How heavy is stupid heavy

[Mountain Rocket]

Having just watched Australian Story my main comment that he didn't have sufficient experience to attempt the Brooks Range.

I created a thread about it here: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10979

[Gadgetgeek]

Being a Canadian, I naturally assume that everything south of the equator is nice and warm, and there is no need for huge pack, so it amazes me to see some of the pack weights. Then I remember that some of you guys hike in the same conditions I used to(ok, not as often as I'd have liked) where a day-pack is 50L because you have to pack for four seasons and an impromptu overnight is very possible (woke up on one camping trip to snow in june back home, and got nearly rinsed off a cliff in rain another time)
I'm super stoked that the pack I used to consider a two-day pack is now a real multi-day pack because there will be actually room for food! (and not needing to carry a spare liter of kerosine, spare parka and snow pants, and maybe snowshoes "just in case")
It really sucks that even simple UL gear isn't common here, and is way marked up (my main pack wights just over 2kg, but it's WAY over built and was very cheap sub-100$ the ultalight equive hits just over 200 back home and well over 400 here) I had the choice to cheap out and still get a pretty great pack.
comfort has weight, so if you need to carry something to have a good time, then its worth while. you might not cover as much ground, but that doesn't matter if you are enjoying it.
A buddy of mine did a pretty crazy multi-day in NZ last year (no one told him the track had been closed for almost a decade, and was almost completely over-gown) he did it with little more than a set of camp clothes, food for the trip, stove, and cup. why? because he is insane, and because he is quite willing to sleep on the ground as long as there is no snow falling, and the temps are a little above zero. I'm not that tough (I'm also not single, that seems to factor into my planning now)
Stupid heavy is having to carry stuff you don't need, on the off chance you might, cuz you'll die if you don't. that was all my old camping stuff. (hint, whisperlite international is a great stove, sucks for solo packing!)

[wayno]

friend of mine reckons he was speaking to some canadians who reckoned they'd never felt colder than they had in NZ... the moisture in the air conducts heat out of the body faster than in really cold dry air, add wind and or rain and it doesnt have to be that cold to cause problems if you're under clothed....
its a balancing act as to what to take. you dont need to be dressed for everest but. if you're wet through. no spare clothes and your tent is wet inside and your sleeping bag is going the same way.... i'd rather be stupid heavy than stupid light.
admitedly i seldom take any shelter but i have so many clothes i'm pretty certain to survive a night out in the open, thats the choice i make.
the rougher or remoter the track the more i lean towards stupid heavy..
some people don't even check the weather. saw a couple of women running the routeburn, windbreakers only. they got through by the skin of their teeth... 300ml of rain in 30 hours from that afternoon on....
i certainly see far more stupid light than stupid heavy in new zealand. the news is full of stories on the tongariro crossing, people dressed for a summers day on a beach doing an alpine crossing at 1800 metres...

[Ent]

Yes good point on the right stuff for the conditions. I had possum gloves wearing them in very cold snow. They worked a treat until it warm up as we got lower as the dry snow melted. Then they acted as evaporative coolers.

Tassie like NZ it is the rain and the cold that challenge gear plus in Tassie the rough scrub and rocks with even the tracks being hard on gear.

Very much a case at chipping away finding what works for you and your conditions.

Cheers

[wayno]

once apon a time i used to be stupid heavy by default. i only had a winter set of gear, that was about the only type of tramping gear i could get in nz in the eighties.... and the internet hadnt arrived to the masses. weather forecasting was a black art
now you can scour the net to get a far more accurate and up to date weather forecast.
you can select gear thats more appropriate to the forecast, with a bit extra in case the forecast is out.... and theres a range of gear to choose for the right conditions
i'm like a fashionista, go to the closet and ask "what shall i wear in the outdoors today?"

[Gadgetgeek]

I hear you wayno, I'm still learning how to deal with humidity, everything about 35% for me is just wet.

[Mark F]

Wayno - remember that in the 80's you still had Piggy Muldoon, a semi-bankrupt economy, amazingly restrictive quotas on imports and amazingly expensive 30 yo Austin A40s so no decent gear got into NZ unless it was smuggled in - I could comment further on that but I may be sued.

[wayno]

Wayno - remember that in the 80's you still had Piggy Muldoon, a semi-bankrupt economy, amazingly restrictive quotas on imports and amazingly expensive 30 yo Austin A40s so no decent gear got into NZ unless it was smuggled in - I could comment further on that but I may be sued.

yes you summed up the situation pretty well... i was sick or working seven days a week for years and stopped tramping, when i came back into it ten years ago. from having only one two or maybe a handful of choices on particular items of gear, often locally and or crudley made gear, i couldnt believe the array of gear that was now available and being imported,
previously you'd get a glimpse of what was available looking at the overseas tourists. but i wasnt prepared for what i found now the import floodgates were open. albeit at inflated prices

i remember a lot of people would make shoping trips from nz to aus in the eighties, you could save so much money if you bought enough that it could be cheaper to have the holiday and buy in aus than to buy the same items in NZ even after duty was thumped on it.

its weird now when i get items shipped to nz. anything over $50 should attract duty and gst but i'm guessing customs are overloaded i only got pinged when the items were over $300,

[Franco]

"Being a Canadian, I naturally assume that everything south of the equator is nice and warm"

I see comments like that in the US forums , some appear to be amazed that we have snow at all...
Here is a shot taken last (mid) spring up at Sterling...

that was after almost 3 days of continuos (cold) rain down below and yes it was much nicer up in the snow...

[wayno]

hmm, havent americans and canadians heard of Antarctica?

[Gadgetgeek]

Franco, That's a great shot mate! yeah, I know better than to think that all of Aus is as warm and damp as the Sunny coast, its a pretty big place after all, and there are parts of Canada that rarely see much snow.(I got pretty cold the last time I was in Adelade, of course idiot me had nothing but cotton shirts and no jacket to wear for the winter rain) I'm glad I packed a few warmish things on this trip, its amazing how cold 8 degrees feels when you've acclimated to 35! When I visited Aus a couple years ago, I needed to buy a sleeping bag, as I'd left my big one at home (didn't figure I'd need a -18 comfort rated bag) Went to a basic camping shop and found a +5 rated bag, that was pretty thin. I thought, How is it that aussies know more about cold weather bags than canadians? this thing is tiny! Then I noticed the tag said, survival rating.... oh, its a warm weather bag alright.
That said, I'm loosing my "cold tolerance" pretty quickly, not that I had much to begin with, if I was looking at treking anywhere there, I'd be wishing for that -18 mummy I'm sure! Like I said, I'm just happy to be able to hike somewhere where I know what season I'm going to get. The Canadian rockies have a nasty habit of pulling a winter weather reunion tour with no warning, and packing the winter survival stuff in july is just plain lame.
Either way, you fine folks can keep your snow to yourself, I want none of it! I'm not here to prove I'm tougher, I don't need to worry about frostbite, the snakes are enough yeah, I know that the two are mutually exclusive, but it helps the punchline.

[nq111]

That said, I'm loosing my "cold tolerance" pretty quickly, not that I had much to begin with, if I was looking at treking anywhere there, I'd be wishing for that -18 mummy I'm sure!

yep - you certainly adapt. I have lived at basically both northern and southern ends of this country and the body's calibration point changes. Sydney has at times felt either seem like a tropical sespit or an antarctic outpost depending on where I am coming from.

Indeed there has been some interesting studies on the 'heatwaves' that cause grief (deaths and the like) around the world. Not surprising, but the closer to the equator the higher the temperature of the heatwave before 'special circumstances' result in deaths of old people etc. Parts of northern europe used to send kids home from school at 28 c due to heat related risk (not sure what the practice is now).

[roysta]

i'm like a fashionista, go to the closet and ask "what shall i wear in the outdoors today?"

+1