volleys

[corvus]

Arseum is the word you are looking for I think

[Son of a Beach]

NB: For anyone who's unsure, and looking for good walking advice... I don't really think that a multi-day walk without shoes is a good idea, and would certainly not recommend it for anyone, experienced, novice, or otherwise. In fact, it is really rather foolish, to be honest. see here for my last failed unplanned attempt at barefoot bushwalking - 3km in a hurry

I do consider myself up to the challenge, however, partly because my feet are already used to it anyhow (eg, climbed the last half of the walk up cradle barefoot, many years ago), and maybe I'm a tad insane (or foolish). I would be carrying boots, as I wouldn't actually expect to make the full distance (and apparently, carrying the boots in my pack will be a seventh of the strain than wearing them on my feet? Just joshing).

[walkinTas]

I've taken into account the "risks" vs advantages and found Volleys more than suitable for 80% of the walking I do. Being unsuitable for certain uses doesn't "end the case" for volleys for every other use.

I'm not really trying to pick on you Michael. Honest, I not! I've seen twenty years of people trying to convince others that walking around the bush in volleys is cool. Cool isn't the first word that springs to mind, but my top ten would end up with { } around them. I don't know the walking conditions in QLD or NSW and I don't know the conditions where you walk. I believe volleys are popular in certain clubs in Sydney (according to Wikipedia ...but that is disputed on other forums).

You recently had a one-day glimpse of the conditions here in Tassie. Those conditions are prevalent here for six months of the year or longer. So perhaps you understand why I'm surprised by some of your statements.

Right now in Tassie it would be totally unacceptable to "risk" hurting yourself on a walk in the highlands or any exposed area. Lets say you have walked three hours away from your car on a day walk. Its 1PM. You've turned your ankle and can't walk. You're alone. Its a day trip so you only have a day pack. You have 4 - 5 hours of sunlight left. No one will miss you before dark. Overnight temperature in Tassie tonight will be well below zero (bushwalking alerts have been issued).

Acceptable risk! I would prefer to Err on the side of caution. Advantages of volleys - they are called "sand" shoes for a reason. Suitable 80% of the time - Not in Tasmania. Unsuitable for certain uses - yep, like highland bushwalking in Tasmania in winter.

But, if it works for you, then I will leave you alone and let you enjoy your walks. And if you are not walking in Tasmania then it won't cost Tassie any money and no Tasmania will have to come looking for you. (another assumption!)

PS: Its ASSUME that make and A S S of U and ME. - but I'll risk it! --- Was Speculator joking? Strange sense of humour - volleys are no joking matter.

[walkinTas]

Yep, barefoot made her legend (but I don't know the details or the reasons).

And if I stop stirring MichaelfromQld for a minute, obviously different people find all sorts of different footwear that works for them. It depends on the track conditions and the weather and the experience you have and the precautions you take and the availability of backup and support and your personal fitness and the load you carry and the distance you walk and how heavy you are and previous injuries and personal walking style and personal likes, and... lots of other things. And there is no such thing as one rule for everyone. There wouldn't be all those choices if one boot/shoe suited everyone.

But it really isn't wise to bushwalk barefooted, and you really should choose your footwear wisely. If you do experiment, please take backup footwear just in case, at least until you have worked out what is best for the different conditions. I guess enjoying the walk is what is important. So choose wisely and stay safe (whatever you're wearing).

(...spelling)

[Son of a Beach]

I think walkinTas has summed it up there. To paraphrase further...

Different strokes for different folks. It is not wise to push your own preference onto somebody else, especially if you don't know their circumstances intimately, and the same choice that is good for you could be dangerous for somebody else.

It's best to play it safe, as far as recommendations go.

However, it's also healthy to discuss all the alternatives. And this has been a great discussion. Please remember to keep it polite and to avoid volleys of personal criticism.

[Son of a Beach]

Corvus, I don't think it is a fair challenge, bootless for jockless. I think you will need to also walk on your hands!

boots on, or boots off?

[MichaelfromQLD]

I've seen twenty years of people trying to convince others that walking around the bush in volleys is cool.

but walking around the bush in volley is cool. You've got the breathable canvas, the ventholes, and if that's not enough step in a puddle and immediately feel the water between your toes.

You recently had a one-day glimpse of the conditions here in Tassie. Those conditions are prevalent here for six months of the year or longer. So perhaps you understand why I'm surprised by some of your statements.

Right now in Tassie it would be totally unacceptable to "risk" hurting yourself on a walk in the highlands or any exposed area. Lets say you have walked three hours away from your car on a day walk. Its 1PM. You've turned your ankle and can't walk. You're alone. Its a day trip so you only have a day pack. You have 4 - 5 hours of sunlight left. No one will miss you before dark. Overnight temperature in Tassie tonight will be well below zero (bushwalking alerts have been issued).

Acceptable risk! I would prefer to Err on the side of caution. Advantages of volleys - they are called "sand" shoes for a reason. Suitable 80% of the time - Not in Tasmania. Unsuitable for certain uses - yep, like highland bushwalking in Tasmania in winter. :

Recent conditions are possible year-round from what I gather, but to me, the idea of someone walking alone in a remote area without overnight gear or an epirb is far more concerning than their footwear choice. That said, I personally wouldn't wear volleys during winter in the highlands either.

--- Was Speculator joking? Strange sense of humour - volleys are no joking matter.

much better. volley good indeed.

[walkinTas]

--- Was Speculator joking? Strange sense of humour - volleys are no joking matter.

much better. volley good indeed.

And if I stop stirring MichaelfomQld for a minute...

...59 ...60 ...times up!

?? What is much better? Do you mean laughing at volleys or chopping your feet off?

[MichaelfromQLD]

I was referring to the way a small injection of humour can help people of different opinions get along, as you had demonstrated.

However I would sooner do both of those things than wear a kilt commando style on cradle cirque this time of year. One might suffer an accumulation of rime, which would could have disasterous consequences.

[corvus]

So now it comes back to folk commenting on what they know absolutely nothing as to what they have experienced Rime frost settles from above ,Scots have gone forth and multiplied in every Continent ,the Kilt has 3 yards of worsted wool in its manufacture and belive me you dont get frosty underneath and I dont see a problem with others having a go with that (just a wee OZ macho thing again ??) I am a proud Aussie albeit imported and Bugger my Kilt doesn't fit me now

[Speculator]

Scots have gone forth and multiplied in every Continent

This, you realise, implies that you know Scots have been shagging in Antarctica? You're a resourceful man Corvus but somehow I doubt you have access to that information!

[corvus]

You obviously have not seen that wee Lassie Polar Bear with a glint in her eye

[corvus]

You are a bunch of cheeky young buggers and guess what I dont care cause I most probaly have done that even b4 you were born

[MichaelfromQLD]

Rime frost settles from above ,Scots have gone forth and multiplied in every Continent ,the Kilt has 3 yards of worsted wool in its manufacture and belive me you dont get frosty underneath

Oh come on Corvus, don't let the facts get in the way of a highly amusing mental image.

[corvus]

And why not MfQ pollies do it all the time and get well paid for it

[tasadam]

However another aspect of the energy expenditure during bushwalking that was explained and demonstrated to me by an "old timer" in the BBW was that you need to "glide" over the terrain as much as possible by careful foot placement, avoiding unnecessary vertical "jogging" movement to your torso and pack, so that you minimise the energy use in raising and lowering your centre of gravity as you walk. Smoothly changing your elevation takes much less energy than rapid changes, especially when recovering from a slip or loss of balance. I recall this "old timer" moving so apparently effortlessly through the bush and seeming to have more energy at the end of the day than us young turks who were jumping all over the place!

An excellent point and one that needs discussed further elsewhere (not under a Volleys thread, but in its own area - much to be learned by this technique.
When I walk I like to see a bit of a way in front of me. When walking too close behind someone I cannot plan my next number of steps so it upsets my rhythm - I notice before long I am somewhat frustrated, feeling like I am being forced to use more exertion.
Choose a route in front of you a little in advance - it works well.

Yes SoaB
We have seen the pics of your feet after a barefoot excursion of only a short distance

Touche!!

Oh, I'm definitely a 'boot's bloke'.

Me too.

It does seem, though, that many tassie walks would be just to rough to not have ankle protection (support aside).

Agreed. How do you attach your gaiters around your volleys?

Why would you compromise basic safety by walking barefoot ,Hereby I issue a challange I will walk the Overland bare A@$ed in a Kilt with any one who wants to do it barefoot dont care Summer or Winter prize is bragging rights that you are still alive.
corvus

That's darn right scary.
The thought of having to do the overland track slowly because of doing it barefoot, thus possibly extending the number of days required to do it, thus extending the number of days where I had to look under your kilt to check you weren't cheating...
I think I'd prefer to stay home and lose.

Rime frost settles from above ,Scots have gone forth and multiplied in every Continent ,the Kilt has 3 yards of worsted wool in its manufacture and belive me you dont get frosty underneath

Oh come on Corvus, don't let the facts get in the way of a highly amusing mental image.

Yeah, thanks ya'all for that, we really needed that mental image, didn't we
Let's keep it that way - a mental image, and not something we should actually see.......

Back to topic, I haven't heard mention the use of orthotics inside your footwear - I have high arches so need orthotics. I have just had another bout of cortizone injections in my plantar fascias in preparation for a walk in November.
I can't see myself walking any great distance on Tassie tracks in volleys - foot problems or not.
The orthotics fit nicely in my Scarpas and that's where they'll stay.

To those of you that can walk in volleys, good luck to you and have a nice time, I mean it without sarcasm.

[johnw]

I found another application for volleys. Recently tried "adventure caving". It's the next step up from the usual tourist cave inspections. Not quite full-blown speleological society stuff, similar but this was probably an easier standard; you wear the same gear etc. Anyway I decided to wear volleys as we had to climb up through a wet cave then descend back down. It's a bit like underground rock scrambling through steep, dusty or slippery limestone sections (with some really contortionist-like moves required through very small gaps and holes ). I found the volleys worked a treat, maintaining positive grip on all surfaces I encountered. However, they are not my preference for normal bushwalking, mainly due to lack of cushioning.

[Billy27]

Did the WA traverse in volleys earlier this year. Was perfectly fine ! Only time that i injured my foot was walking around barefoot in a burnt out button grass patch
Personally I like the grip they have on rocks and they're a whole darn lot cheaper than a pair of good boots.

Each to their own though !