Cuben Fiber Tent

[ULWalkingPhil]

If the inner tent has cuben lower walls you may get that height back by raising the fly? I'd imagine you want the gap (and airflow) in most situations.
While the gap (between fly/inner) is probably important i'd be wanting to keep as much internal space as possible. Personally i'd want ample space without/before needing mid panel guy points to maintain it. You could also pitch the fly on an angle (ie more gap on the door side).

Yes, in warmer climates I plan to set the outer up higher to allow air flow. The Leki Poles I purchased will extend out to 145cm.

[Nuts]

MLD say 54" (137cm) but i'd imagine that is minimal height, another inch or two won't make a big difference to the pitch (but may give enough fly/inner gap as the inner will always be pitched to the ground..) Maybe make francos line setup and then pitch the fly to see what happens (before deciding on final inner dimensions) (edit: though this design really needs the same (preferably more) inner tent height as the fly height doesn't it, perhaps going a bit taller (with those same floor dimensions) would be wize?

[Franco]

I have seen several projects of this type ( A frame and pyramid tents) where people overestimate the USABLE space and that is easy to do if looking at figures.
However in the end it has to work for you not me but that kind of mock up takes me less than ten minutes do do and costs me nothing so you could do the same...

[ULWalkingPhil]

Spoken to Evan this morning, he told me the outer shelter only has about 20 grams to be added in features to the weight I posted earlier, this will make the shelter less than 300 grams, includes linelocs and I believe the line as well.

I'm putting together a similar contraption to what Franco has shown to work out an ideal inner size for me. Will post some images soon.

[ULWalkingPhil]

I have completed the mock setup as suggested and shown by Franco, Thanks for the tip Franco.

The following image is me inside my inner with the following sizes.

260cm long x 130cm high x 75.5cm wide. The is the original size Evan was going to build my inner. I think it's a bit to large for me, and will be to close to the outer of my shelter which is 270 long x 135 high by 155 wide.

[ULWalkingPhil]

I reckon if I drop Evan's size down on the height and the length it should give me plenty of room and less chance of the inner touching the outer.

The following images I have dropped the height down to 123cm, and length 252cm. The width is the same at 75.5cm. I might have to get the width narrowed a bit, I'm not sure how close it is to the outer.

I've taken an image with my camera looking straight down the ends of the inner to give an indication how much room I have at the ends at this measurement.

[ULWalkingPhil]

Bare in mind that the outer shelter will be at those given sizes when it's pitched to the ground, Most of the time, if not all the time it will be pitched higher of the ground to allow for ventilation under neath the out shelter, I plan to pitch the outer at 145cm height with my brand new Leki pole 99% of the time.

I've suggested to Evan to make the 3 sides of the inner in Cuben extending up 20cm. I wonder at times if this is enough and if I should extend the sides up by 25cm.

I am thinking of suggesting to Evan to make my inner 8 cm shorter both in height and length.

[photohiker]

Hmm. You will need to be careful to get the size right. Good idea to get the outer and do a bit of a mock-up before you decide.

I'm seeing the wisdom of the TT Notch 2 pole setup now, as well as the single pole Trailstar/Ookstar combination. (Both heavier though at a bit over 800g complete)

Do you have an estimated weight for the inner? Interested to see what you decide re zip layout on the inner.

[ULWalkingPhil]

Hmm. You will need to be careful to get the size right. Good idea to get the outer and do a bit of a mock-up before you decide.

I'm seeing the wisdom of the TT Notch 2 pole setup now, as well as the single pole Trailstar/Ookstar combination. (Both heavier though at a bit over 800g complete)

Do you have an estimated weight for the inner? Interested to see what you decide re zip layout on the inner.

This is what alway's had me concerned with the DuoMid. The length I'm not sure it was long enough, getting them custom made, I have the chance to get this right, but me here way up in QLD and Evan in Melbourne is a bit of an challenge. If only I could drop by and try for my self, laying in the outer and seeing how much room I have.

I'm leaving that upto Evan on the zips for the inner, but I've seen an image of a shelter similar to mine with the Cuben Floor I'm using on his website and it's just over 300 grams. Surprisingly heavier than my shelter.

[ULWalkingPhil]

I might have gone to low on the Height of 123 cm. maybe, considering probably 99% of the time this shelter will be pitched up high by an extra 10cm, I could probably get the height up a bit higher, this might give me a tad bit more room on the ends, with a steeper slope. I doubt a few cm's would make much difference. It's tricky when I've never seen one of these shelters in person. This is a problem I have up here in QLD on all gear I wish to purchase.

[photohiker]

I've suggested to Evan to make the 3 sides of the inner in Cuben extending up 20cm. I wonder at times if this is enough and if I should extend the sides up by 25cm.

Ookworks do theirs 50cm as an option:



Bearpaaw does theirs 10" (25cm) on three sides in sil or cuben as an option:



Depends where it will get most use I guess.

Re height, you might like to have a look at the Ookworks blog. He has recently made the top of his nest adjustable to cater for lower pitch height.

[Nuts]

It will be a full inner though?? Not hung off the pole but the pole inside the inner?? The inner, 'therefore, needs to be Higher than the fly ( or am I missing something?) I wouldn't use much fabic to block the airflow personally unless your thinking of lots of winter/ snow trips. You can always use more layers inside though when its warm you'll be more likely to Need the inner for bugs..ie Sweatbox??

[ULWalkingPhil]

No it's not a full inner, the inner is for one person and will be half the size of the outer, pole is outside inner.

I better check with Evan that this is the case, to be honest I've never spoke to Evan about the location of the pole with the inner. I am presuming it will be on the outside of the inner.

[ULWalkingPhil]

It will be a full inner though?? Not hung off the pole but the pole inside the inner?? The inner, 'therefore, needs to be Higher than the fly ( or am I missing something?) I wouldn't use much fabic to block the airflow personally unless your thinking of lots of winter/ snow trips. You can always use more layers inside though when its warm you'll be more likely to Need the inner for bugs..ie Sweatbox??

Don't matter where you go up here in QLD during summer it's a sweat box, we just get used to it. Humidity is the killer.

[photohiker]

It will be a full inner though?? Not hung off the pole but the pole inside the inner?? The inner, 'therefore, needs to be Higher than the fly ( or am I missing something?) I wouldn't use much fabic to block the airflow personally unless your thinking of lots of winter/ snow trips. You can always use more layers inside though when its warm you'll be more likely to Need the inner for bugs..ie Sweatbox??

Now I'm missing something

If the inner was higher than the fly, it'd have to be an 'outer' wouldn't it? By definition, the inner can be no higher than the fly, regardless of pole inside or outside the inner.

[Nuts]

Well yes (but no).. My golite (SL3) shelter is the type with an inner full 'nest' and outer fly. If both were pitched separately (tie outs pegged to the ground) i'd guess that the inner would be higher. Pitched together, the fly is 'pitched' higher but its no longer pegged in at ground level, there is now a gap below the fly edge, i'd say the sides of the fly are (if not the same length) shorter. The two touch at the peak, gap between the fly and nest is maintained as the fly is cut to be pitched at a wider angle than the nest..

None of which matters with Philips nest design. Though I would add that I have a Oookworks half inner for 'my' SL3. Even at that size it is just starting to feel big 'enough'..

[photohiker]

Got it. Thanks for the explanation.

[weeman]

Are you getting Evan to install a buckle on the bottom of the zipper like MLD does with the MID's? The zipper seems to be the weakest link with these types of shelters.

[cams]

That mockup of the inner looks pretty tight to me. Don't forget about the added size of a sleeping bag at your feet and the arc that your head makes as you sit up.

[forest]

That mockup of the inner looks pretty tight to me. Don't forget about the added size of a sleeping bag at your feet and the arc that your head makes as you sit up.

That's what I thought. Not a lot of free space for a puffy bag. Add in wind and possible moisture and you might have contact between the outer, inner and bag... That's far from good.

[ULWalkingPhil]

Are you getting Evan to install a buckle on the bottom of the zipper like MLD does with the MID's? The zipper seems to be the weakest link with these types of shelters.

I believe Evan is using a stronger zip.

[ULWalkingPhil]

That mockup of the inner looks pretty tight to me. Don't forget about the added size of a sleeping bag at your feet and the arc that your head makes as you sit up.

It's still larger than the inner MLD makes for there Duo. I've tilted my head up a bit in the image above of me laying in the shelter to imitate a pillow.

I am thinking about sticking to the original height that Evan Suggests of 130cm for the inner and going shorter on the length. This should allow enough clearance when I pitch the outer down to the ground on the occasions when there's a cold breeze blowing in. I think the extra height will allow more room.

[ULWalkingPhil]

That mockup of the inner looks pretty tight to me. Don't forget about the added size of a sleeping bag at your feet and the arc that your head makes as you sit up.

That's what I thought. Not a lot of free space for a puffy bag. Add in wind and possible moisture and you might have contact between the outer, inner and bag... That's far from good.

Don't forget the shelter will mostly be pitched an extra 10cm higher over the inner shelter most of the time. On those warm or cool nights having the outer up higher should eliminate the condensation issue and with a higher pitch on the Outer there will be more clearance between the inner and the outer.

I'm going to stay with Evan's suggestions of a height of 130cm for the inner.

The measurements I'm working on for the inner is for those times when I have to pitch the outer at ground level, mainly if it's very cold outside, I guess this is when the condensation can get bad.

[photohiker]

The only reason I'd pitch it at ground level would be because of high winds or driving rain.

Cold you can deal with, cuben up the side of the nest will help.

[ULWalkingPhil]

The only reason I'd pitch it at ground level would be because of high winds or driving rain.

Cold you can deal with, cuben up the side of the nest will help.

That's what I should have said, Cold high winds, otherwise always pitched up high. Is it not true that condensation is mainly an issue on still nights? On still calm nights I would have the outer pitched up high. In windy conditions there should be little chance of condensation.

[ULWalkingPhil]

In regards to the Buckle. for the outer, Evan is indeed going to place a buckle on the zipper down low on the outer.

I think Evan is doing a great job on this build. We are both excited on the weight of the shelter.

[photohiker]

Is it not true that condensation is mainly an issue on still nights?

Yep, and a closed shelter with little airflow on any other night

Still nights, pitch high and open the door and vents. On wet ground a groundcloth in the vestibule helps too.

[ULWalkingPhil]

When I had my Hilleberg Tent, it used to gather a lot of condensation inside the outer on calm nights, but it never made it to the inner shelter, used to just sit there the droplets unless you bumped them, than you had a quick shower.

I read somewhere under some conditions Cuben Fiber don't gather condensation as much as Sil Nylon, What conditions I don't know. I will find out soon enough. Going by my Cuben Tarp for my Hammock, this appears the case, It don't appear to gather the condensation like my Superfly does.

[ULWalkingPhil]

Nearing completion. Not a lot left to be done.
I think the Colour is awesome. Love the Cuben. Great job Evan.

[ULWalkingPhil]

Im surprised no one commented on my almost complete shelter, its going through the finishing touches now. Should be completed by the end of the week.