Tarptents bad ordering customer service

[Kingsleythelost]

I actually own a 3 person goondie for my family hiking. But i dont really like the 2 pitch setup inner then outer although a beautiful tent. When i read and understood about the exoskeleton i thought wow thats a great idea you can pitch it in the rain and all inside is dry.

Im 6ft 7 tall in the old scale and 195cm ....

I mostly walk through NSW SE. So any of the parks along the green strip between Sydney and Bega along the coast or inland towards Kangaroo Valley etc... Im also planning on doing a bunch of Snowy Mountains walks this summer (got three planned). On my next to do list includes the Castle and light to light. Not looking for a snow tent.

I wonder why its advertised as a 3 season as opposed to a 4?

[Kingsleythelost]

Since ive got your attention with my rant what do people think of this tent?

http://www.terra-nova.co.uk/tents-and-s ... on-2-tent/

For me it ticks all the boxes 900Grams , 2 person although i cant see the dimensions. 2 Wall, small pack , I love the 2 wall as you can take the inner down. Doesnt require tent poles. A little on the expensive side but wow it looks nice.

I guess some questions of durability and air movement remain....Also the data sheet suggests 2.3 meters log but thats the peak im 2m long myself i wonder how much it cuts in at the sides

May I point out that you will also have to seam seal this tent yourself:

LMAO i wont be asking them to do it .....ill do that myself... still LMAO.... If id known it was going to delay my tent beyond my expected date def would have made other arrangements.

[icefest]

I wonder why its advertised as a 3 season as opposed to a 4?

I believe is it just not that strong, here is a video of one in a normal storm, I'd hardly want to be in this in a blizzard.

[Mark F]

I bought a 1 person version several years ago and agree with the comment about condensation. The 2 person is very tight for 2 - 90 cm wide extending to 105 in the centre and only one door, so the one at back is endlessly climbing over the other person.

[Kingsleythelost]

There was a lot of discussion about money and who owns it etc....Not my issue really but as a matter of interest even though TT have apparently refunded my money the funds are still not in my account....Looks like ill have to wait longer to get my new tent....

Ill stop now!

[neilmny]

Kingsleythe lost...... a tip from an old bloke for future reference .....you catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.

[Kingsleythelost]

I bought a 1 person version several years ago and agree with the comment about condensation. The 2 person is very tight for 2 - 90 cm wide extending to 105 in the center and only one door, so the one at back is endlessly climbing over the other person.

Would you recommend this tent? It will mostly be a solo tent but occasionally id like to squeeze a partner in. Apparently there was an update to the tent to help with condensation? I do like the weight on it less than the TT and double walled ...90cm is tight for a 2 (my mat width*2)

[wayno]

There was a lot of discussion about money and who owns it etc....Not my issue really

thats the way cottage industry companies roll. you can't apply the same mentality to them that you can the large well resourced companies, if you don't like it, then you have other choices.
cottage industries do have their advantages and theres a lot of very experienced bushwalkers on here who have vouched for that on here and will vouch for the quality of the gear and overall service.

[Kingsleythelost]

Kingsleythe lost...... a tip from an old bloke for future reference .....you catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.

Thems are wise words....i did try the honey first!

[South_Aussie_Hiker]

Hi Kingsley.

Sorry to hear about your bad tent ordering experience.

But I think you are still angry about it, and you are allowing this to cloud your judgement. I understand you are annoyed because you were expecting something in a time frame, but this means you are less likely to see the situation for what it really was.

Firstly, money
- Based on my limited knowledge of this, it appears you still seem unable to grasp the concept. Let's say it's a debit card attached to a savings account. The only thing which occurred was a HOLD was placed on the money so that you couldn't spend it on anything else. It was still there, in it's entirity, in your account, earning interest.
Let's say you had $5000 sitting in that account and your tent was $300. Your available funds would have been $4700 (because the $300 is being held), but there is still $5000 sitting in your savings account. You just can't access it all. You are still earning interest on $5000 until the transaction occurs. If the account is a mortgage offset, your mortgage is still being offset by the full $5000 until the transaction actually occurs (which it never did). You are not out of pocket one cent.

The money for me wasn't an issue i just pointed out in the original message that it was paid for yet people wish to focus on that

People focus on this because this was one of your main gripes in the original posts, in particular that you had "paid" for express postage.

They got my money and i need gratification Disgruntled consumer

You can't provide a scenario to the forum complaining that you paid for something you didn't get, and then have a go at forum members tyring to provide friendly advice for focusing on it too much. It might be annoying that you saw the hold on your money (internet banking or whatever), but the reality is that it's completely irrelevant.

Secondly, Emails
You have I guess realised that you were a bit over the top with your initial reaction, and even said you've emailed Henry and said as much - so that's a good start. You are ALWAYS going to find you get further by collaborating with people to achieve what you want, rather than berating them in an email or setting up a forum post to air the dirty laundry.
I don't think Tarptent's response was satisfactory. Despite the fact that they didn't promise the tent on a certain date (they said "likely") and didn't technically owe you anything, it would have been much better business practice for them to try and make good on the delay. They could have offered a $50 discount, or perhaps even copped the shipping at their expense in an effort to keep everyone happy.
What you could have done is presented your case without the sledgehammer. If you weren't going to get your tent on time for your planned trip, I would have emailed them and said I was disappointed and needed to rent a tent for the trip because of the delays, and could they consider springing for the cost of the tent rental so you weren't left out of pocket. A nicely worded email along these lines probably would have seen a much better chance of success. Franco might have even been able to provide a lend of an old or used tarptent he has lying around for your trip. You never know if you don't ask!

Unfortunately I don't see a way forward for you here. While Henry's reply was particularly blunt and probably not ideal, it wasn't unprovoked, and I guess he wants to spend time on successful transactions rather than time/resources (which = money) on email chains of arguing.

Having said that, a well worded and long winded email reply and apology suggesting a fair solution for you and Tarptent might see a way forward, rather than being ignored (including offering to remove this topic from bushwalk.com). If you don't offer a solution which means you both win, they will continue to ignore your emails.

I have the MSR series (Mutha Hubba HP) and the new NX looks good, although probably a bit less weather/wind tolerant.

A lot of people on the forum seem to have the Goondie, so maybe PM someone for information or maybe even to organise a meet up.

Hope it works out for you.

[Kingsleythelost]

Hi Kingsley.

- Based on my limited knowledge of this, it appears you still seem unable to grasp the concept. Let's say it's a debit card attached to a savings account. The only thing which occurred was a HOLD was placed on the money so that you couldn't spend it on anything else. It was still there, in it's entirity, in your account, earning interest.
Let's say you had $5000 sitting in that account and your tent was $300. Your available funds would have been $4700 (because the $300 is being held), but there is still $5000 sitting in your savings account. You just can't access it all.

The money for me wasn't an issue i just pointed out in the original message that it was paid for yet people wish to focus on that

People focus on this because this was one of your main gripes in the original posts, in particular that you had "paid" for express postage.

Let me explain i upgraded the post so i could get it quicker so as opposed to standard usps i "paid" the extra as first class express so i could be assured it would arrive on time. I then expressed the time to Henry.

On the money front im not interested in interest if i cant spend the money then its not there! Now for example i wish to buy a different tent but the money is not in my account. I fully understand the whole $ in the account thing interest etc... Im not running a business with 1000's of dollars involved i work i spend...now... no money = no spend...

You are 100% correct on my email and his response he was probably having a bad day as was i because i realised i wasnt going to get my new tent before i headed into the mountains and have to lug an extra 2Kg's of luxury living up with me . This is why i sent an apology not a detailed full length one but an apology none the less.

I have now had other tent options

[Franco]

There there are plenty of good shelters out there so lets just move on...

OutdoorGearLabs has a 26 tent review comparing exactly this type of tent side by side.

http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Backpacking-Tent-Reviews
(ignore the DR...)
OGL buy most of their gear , they bought our DR , so are less biased than some.
If nothing else one can compare specs without having to go all over the Net.

BTW, I think Photohiker should be thanked for asking the "how tall are you ?" question.
Lets say that not many Light Weight tents can comfortably hold a 195cm tall person

[Kingsleythelost]

Im trying to get this thread removed as i dont think it achieves anything other than teaching me to take a deep breath before i send a rant email....Not sure of the options

[Kingsleythelost]

There there are plenty of good shelters out there so lets just move on...

OutdoorGearLabs has a 26 tent review comparing exactly this type of tent side by side.

http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Backpacking-Tent-Reviews
(ignore the DR...)
OGL buy most of their gear , they bought our DR , so are less biased than some.
If nothing else one can compare specs without having to go all over the Net.

BTW, I think Photohiker should be thanked for asking the "how tall are you ?" question.
Lets say that not many Light Weight tents can comfortably hold a 195cm tall person

I just sort of squeeze into most things including economy seats! Most of the tents are just over 2m which leaves me a little squashed but not to bad. It doesnt help i pump at the gym a lot and have a big frame! Try finding size 15 hiking boots/boats!

[wayno]

Im trying to get this thread removed as i dont think it achieves anything other than teaching me to take a deep breath before i send a rant email....Not sure of the options

you'll have to wait till an admin has time to deal with it.. they lead busy lives

[South_Aussie_Hiker]

Im trying to get this thread removed as i dont think it achieves anything other than teaching me to take a deep breath before i send a rant email....Not sure of the options

Just PM an admin/moderator and detail why you'd like it removed, and I'm sure they'll get to it when they get a chance. The main forum home page has a "Who's Online" section at the bottom, showing (strangely enough) who is online at the moment and which ones are admin/moderators.

i dont think it achieves anything other than teaching me to take a deep breath before i send a rant email

It's good you can see through this different eyes now. It's not easy to admit you could have done things better.

Here's hoping Tarptent realise the same thing and get back in contact with you to try and find an amicable solution. Hint hint, nudge nudge.

[Onestepmore]

No, I don't think this thread should be deleted. It's been an interesting discussion, and offers insight into overseas ordering, and allowed debate regarding business practises and expectations.

If you want an MSR NX version of the 1 P Hubba or 2P Hubba Hubba you'll need to wait until next year, as they are not available until then
http://www.cascadedesigns.com/msr/tents ... nx/product
Mind you, with the brand you'll have the usual problems of importing them into Australia (I have sent a PM)

Terra Nova have a good name, and the links Wayno give above will put you into contact with a great UK company - Ultralight Outdoor Gear - I've had very good personalised service and communication from them. Postage has reasonable and swift (better than from the USA)
http://www.outdoorsmagic.com/forum/gear ... 20592.html is a comparison review.
Terra Nova Laser Photon 2 http://www.terra-nova.co.uk/tents-and-s ... on-2-tent/
Ultralight Outdoor Gear - their 2 P tent range http://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/ ... -tents-c26
blogpackinglight also has reviews for Terra Nova tents, and various modifications - a UK hillwalker Laser Comp http://blogpackinglight.wordpress.com/laser-comp-mods/

I have enough tents to fulfil the needs of our family in all it's permutations of 1P 2P 3P - 3 and 4 season, but I love researching more!

[wayno]

I have enough tents to fulfil the needs of our family in all it's permutations of 1P 2P 3P - 3 and 4 season, but I love researching more!

[icefest]

Ha, puts an entire new spin on the term 'track marks', wayno.

[Onestepmore]

/bows

I should have a bonding meeting with Forest

And straight away, I see that guy in the pic, and I start to analyse his gear
Knife too big....
Does he really need that much down on for the ambient temp.....
His boots are too heavy...
Is that really a Nalgene bottle he's carrying...!?

[wayno]

the defence rests, your honour...

[icefest]

I though it was a jetboil. He could save at least 3g by cutting off his tags though...

[perfectlydark]

5 years in hosppitality and if "two bit" is over the top rude enough to cancel and carry on this outfit have been very lucky. Ive been called 20 times worse within 10 minutes of many shifts. Yes custom orders can be dependant on many factors, the issue was a lack of communicatiom followed by being dropped. Being "cottage" or big name what difference.does it make? That was pretty poor service

[GPSGuided]

No, I don't think this thread should be deleted. It's been an interesting discussion, and offers insight into overseas ordering, and allowed debate regarding business practises and expectations.

＋1

There are no wasted discussions. There's always a message somewhere, including how many ways "meaningless" can be expressed in forum threads.

[photohiker]

5 years in hosppitality and if "two bit" is over the top rude enough to cancel and carry on this outfit have been very lucky. Ive been called 20 times worse within 10 minutes of many shifts. Yes custom orders can be dependant on many factors, the issue was a lack of communicatiom followed by being dropped. Being "cottage" or big name what difference.does it make? That was pretty poor service

I disagree. Cottage means everyone (ie one or two people) are carrying out every task to keep the business running. People who demand things that are not achievable and then make a big deal of it and get aggro consume time and energy that is required to keep the business running. It may seem unfair, but in fact it is unfair to the rest of the customer base to pander to these people and only adds more stress to an already stressful day.

Part of customer service is knowing when you're on a hiding to nothing and knowing when to cut an overly demanding customer loose. There is a often repeated maxim that 'The customer is always right' and this is true within reason. Once the customer steps beyond the line, they are no longer right.

A couple of relevant quotes:

"Lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part! "

"If you fail to plan, you are planning to fail!"

[iluvhiking]

I own a few tarptents over the years..... nothing but excellent service from both Henry and Franco!

[iluvhiking]

I've had nothing but great service from both Henry and Franco over the years - one of the best "cottage" service equipment people in my opinion.

[GPSGuided]

Cottage means everyone (ie one or two people) are carrying out every task to keep the business running. People who demand things that are not achievable and then make a big deal of it and get aggro consume time and energy that is required to keep the business running. It may seem unfair, but in fact it is unfair to the rest of the customer base to pander to these people and only adds more stress to an already stressful day.

Yep, dealing with difficult customers is one thing that a cottage industry owner has a lot of choice over. Quite simply and to the running of a small dedicated business, it's just not worth the troubles. Further, they are entering their Thanksgiving season and invariably there'll be considerable work pressure for an operation like Tarptents.

[Kingsleythelost]

5 years in hosppitality and if "two bit" is over the top rude enough to cancel and carry on this outfit have been very lucky. Ive been called 20 times worse within 10 minutes of many shifts. Yes custom orders can be dependant on many factors, the issue was a lack of communicatiom followed by being dropped. Being "cottage" or big name what difference.does it make? That was pretty poor service

I disagree. Cottage means everyone (ie one or two people) are carrying out every task to keep the business running. People who demand things that are not achievable and then make a big deal of it and get aggro consume time and energy that is required to keep the business running. It may seem unfair, but in fact it is unfair to the rest of the customer base to pander to these people and only adds more stress to an already stressful day.

Part of customer service is knowing when you're on a hiding to nothing and knowing when to cut an overly demanding customer loose. There is a often repeated maxim that 'The customer is always right' and this is true within reason. Once the customer steps beyond the line, they are no longer right.

A couple of relevant quotes:

"Lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part! "

"If you fail to plan, you are planning to fail!"

It was planned only thing that didnt account for was a lack of communication

Secondly i wasnt a demanding customer i just got the sh its becuase i was not communicated with. Even then I was happy to go through the order.

Photo hiker did you read the thead?

Cottage means everyone (ie one or two people) are carrying out every task to keep the business running. People who demand things that are not achievable and then make a big deal of it and get aggro consume time and energy that is required to keep the business running. It may seem unfair, but in fact it is unfair to the rest of the customer base to pander to these people and only adds more stress to an already stressful day.

Yep, dealing with difficult customers is one thing that a cottage industry owner has a lot of choice over. Quite simply and to the running of a small dedicated business, it's just not worth the troubles. Further, they are entering their Thanksgiving season and invariably there'll be considerable work pressure for an operation like Tarptents.

The email is all there is to this discussion he decided to cut me off because of one comment that he didnt like even though he failed to deliver or communicate with me. Please at least read thread.

Ive appreciated and understood a fair few of the comments along the way however those last two ???

All of a sudden ive become a demanding customer that has failed to plan.....rather than making these broad statements would you care to explain where i was demanding or where i failed to plan. I kow the timeline was a little short but hey i thought 2 weeks was plenty of time to get a product to me! And by asking Henry for a date i did plan.l

[icefest]

I waited 6 months before ordering my zpacks pack because I preferred a 4 week wait over a 10 week wait. I was happy to only have to wait 4 weeks until they had made my pack.
2 weeks is really short term for the cottage industry.

Did you really say "I plan on splashing that email all around the internet thanks"?