Bushwalk Australia

Hi everyone,

I've recently been wanting to upgrade my sleeping mat to something more lightweight and compact. I've narrowed it down to two choices, the Thermarest Prolite and the Exped Synmat UL 7. Both are 460g so weight is not a variable. From my research what it comes down to is the Prolite wins for durability and price whereas the Synmat wins for comfort and warmth. I'm currently leaning towards the prolite being budget conscious but I'm interested in what experiences people here might have had.

Exped Exped Exped!

The exped mats are a LOT more comfy. At LOT more !!

75mm vs 25mm. 460g vs 460g No brainer for me.
Oh and the exped's have the outer most tubes 85mm high. Minimises that rolling of the sides sensation you can get with narrower mats.

I only have experience with the Exped Synmat UL 7S and it has not been the best. For sure when it is up it is comfy and pretty quiet ... just a small problem keeping it up. It is not in my experience very durable and hence for my upcoming ride of the Munda Biddi Trail I will be using a sheet of Aortha EVA Very Low Density 3 mm with it (should have got 2mm with hindsight). Hopefully this provides the level of protection required.

My first mat was in use until July 2012, so about a year of use where it got used less than 10 nights. It de-laminate internally. Thankfully Mainpeak got a replacement mat to me on the road but still I had a few uncomfortable nights.

The this new mat survived around 25 nights of use before it starting deflating again. Upon my return to Perth I took it back to MainPeak to see if they could find the cause (I had been unsuccessful). They found one leak and fixed it but I still had a deflating tent. It was used on top of a Tyvek ground sheet but that it help.

Eventually just before I gave up on it all together and was about to order a Therm-a-Rest I read a post about checking for leaks in hot water. That worked and I found the cause.

So at this point in time I still using the Exped but being pretty wary of its durability.

I am not sure I would bother with Exped again and think I would go with a Therm-a-Rest next time. I was disappointed with Exped's customer service and have heard more positive things about Therm-a-Rest's approach to its customers. Either way keep in mind that the Synmat UL models are whilst on the light side there is a durability cost and there is a two year warranty (versus five year) for a reason.

Andrew

I have both of these mats and of the two I would opt for the Exped, however, given that I like to muddy the waters, I have a better suggestion.
Why not think about the Thermarest Neoair Xtherm?
Now this is a cracker of a mat with a R rating of 5.7, good for snow.
430g for the regular (183cm)

I also HIGHLY recommend the Neoair series.

The XTHERM is super warm and packs down as small as a coke can, definitely smaller than the Synmat.

If concerned about durability, the Neo All Season is bullet proof.

Even the heavier All Season is lighter than the Synmat. Both have significantly better thermal performance, too.

2 years vs. lifetime warranty.

Provided you find the horizontal baffles comfortable (which I certainly do, but then I do like a firm bed) then it's an absolute no brainer. I'm sure a local bushwalk.com member would happily let you lay on one to try it out.

Have you tried an Exped, SA Hiker?

I bought a Neoair and hated it so on sold it and got Downmat. Never going back!

South_Aussie_Hiker wrote:Even the heavier All Season is lighter than the Synmat. Both have significantly better thermal performance, too.

Doesn't a regular sized All Season weigh 540g making it somewhat heavier than a similar sized synmat UL 7?

For a tiny 80g more than the All Season you could have the Synmat UL 9, with an impressive R of 6.0 and a luxurious 9cm.

Doesn't a regular sized All Season weigh 540g making it somewhat heavier than a similar sized synmat UL 7?

Right you are. I just googled the specs, and it seems the website I found had the weights listed incorrectly.

Have you tried an Exped, SA Hiker?

I bought a Neoair and hated it so on sold it and got Downmat. Never going back!

Yeah, someone let me have a go on one when I was upgrading. I didn't think it any better in the comfort stakes (if anything, not quite as good) but then that's why I said in my OP it depends on what sort of bed you like - I'm definitely someone who likes a very firm mattress. I could understand a bigger person preferring the vertical chambers rather than the horizontal for more edge support, but I'm like a rake so it doesn't concern me. There definitely did seem to be more Exped failures than Neoair using a simple Google search at the time, and that doesn't seem to have changed. When there's no foam in there, you really have to be confident the mat isn't going to let you down mid trip.

Like I said - try and find someone local to you in the ACT and give them both a try.

Yeah I am a bigger person, plus I also roll around a lot in my sleep. The edge support and the noise were the biggest downsides for me in the NeoAir.

Strider wrote:Yeah I am a bigger person, plus I also roll around a lot in my sleep. The edge support and the noise were the biggest downsides for me in the NeoAir.

I got my neoair xtherm this week and tried it out for two nights. Have you tried it out? I read the reviews saying it was noisy and ignored them because I don't move around much at night, and yes, it is noisy when you're unrolling it and blowing it up/packing it down but when I was actually on it it didn't make a sound, I tried moving around lots and still couldn't really hear it. I'd say it was quieter than my old Big Agnes air core.

ejayt wrote:

Strider wrote:Yeah I am a bigger person, plus I also roll around a lot in my sleep. The edge support and the noise were the biggest downsides for me in the NeoAir.

Have you tried it out?

I used it for one night and hardly slept a wink. The horizontal baffles don't conform to body shape well, there is zero edge support, and I felt like I was sleeping on a chip packet every time I moved.

ah fair enough you're right, it is really small. luckily I sleep like a log

I've been out of the game for too long. I sleep on an older Prolite 4 and whilst I have zero complaints regarding its performance, these newer 'air core' mats seem to be awesome as far as comfort, weight and size are concerned.

My $0.02

We were all pretty happy with our thermrest self-inflators when they were the pinnacle of technology and before that our closed cell foam.

But i think the exped (and i guess neoairs) are just a better mousetrap. Smaller in the pack and more fore-giving of lumps and bumps on the ground. So they get my vote.

My main reason for not considering the neoair is the noise complaints that a lot of people seem to make. I sometimes get a bit agitated when I'm sleeping and don't mind a good roll around, would hate to be 'that guy'. I guess I will have to try one out. I'm beginning to be swayed towards the exped or neoair.

I always hear these complaints about noise mentioned in relation to the NeoAir range but from my experience it is completely negligible.
For me I find my sleeping bag shell just as noisy when I roll around and I struggle to distinguish the two noises.

It is also worth mentioning that different mats in the NeoAir range are all slightly different in terms of the noise they make and how loud it might be. For instance my Xtherm is noisier and perhaps 'crinklier' than my partners All Season. With that said for the comfort, warmth, size and weight I could never go back to a traditional core-foam mat. The technology is old and both the Synmat and NeoAir range for instance offer substantial improvements.

I agree the noise is a minor complaint Robert...when compared to the rock hard baffles and complete lack of edge stability.

Baffles can be as hard as you want, as with any inflatable mat. Personally I have no issue with it and have always slept well on mine.
I also find it actually convenient to have the valve at your head so you can deflate it as you see fit without having to get out of your sleeping bag (unlike Exped?).

Edge support? Never had a problem. I typically sleep next to my partner who also has a NeoAir so the whole idea of edge support would be detrimental to how I use the mat(s).

Strider wrote:Have you tried an Exped, SA Hiker? I bought a Neoair and hated it so on sold it and got Downmat. Never going back!

I should've mentioned earlier that I also have a Down mat 7S and yes, it's good.
However, at 710g (R rating 5.9) compared to the Xtherm at 485g and R rating 5.7, it gets used for sleeping in the back of the X-Trail these days.

Robert H wrote:I always hear these complaints about noise mentioned in relation to the NeoAir range but from my experience it is completely negligible.

I've had the Xtherm out several times and I really don't know what all this talk of noise is.
I find it a nice piece of kit, will get to try it on snow soon enough.

Noise? What's that?

Robert H wrote:I also find it actually convenient to have the valve at your head so you can deflate it as you see fit without having to get out of your sleeping bag (unlike Exped?).

Exped are a rectangular mat and therefore have no designated head/foot ends.

north-north-west wrote:Noise? What's that?

Sorry, I can't hear you over all the crinkling!

Aushiker wrote: I will be using a sheet of Aortha EVA Very Low Density 3 mm with it (should have got 2mm with hindsight). Hopefully this provides the level of protection required.

Actually, I'd recommend using 3mm EVA with either of the Thermarest or the Exped. It's not the brand so much as the thin materials that both manufacturers using, and even a thin layer of foam can reduce the risk of puncturing from thorns, sticks, rocks, etc. My 180 cm of 3mm EVA weighs about 150g. Kinda bumps the weight of the overall system up, but I still love them for the comfort and insulating value.

I didn't know 2mm existed.

Mad

Would having a Tyvek footprint under the tent floor or even under the mat itself do the trick?

neilmny wrote:Would having a Tyvek footprint under the tent floor or even under the mat itself do the trick?

I was thinking the same thing.

As far a the noise of NeoAirs are concerned (I have XLite Small (R 3.2) and a Womens (R 3.9) for winter and used to have an original NeoAir small) I found they were noisy if you slept on a rigid flat surface like on a sleeping platform but very little noise when on a tent floor pitched on a natural surface.

neilmny wrote:Would having a Tyvek footprint under the tent floor or even under the mat itself do the trick?

I use Tyvek as a footprint for my Tarptent Scarp 1 and hence my Exped Synmat UL 7S and I have still punctured. Of course I don't know if it would have occurred more often without the Tyvek.

Andrew

Aushiker wrote:

neilmny wrote:Would having a Tyvek footprint under the tent floor or even under the mat itself do the trick?

I use Tyvek as a footprint for my Tarptent Scarp 1 and hence my Exped Synmat UL 7S and I have still punctured. Of course I don't know if it would have occurred more often without the Tyvek.

Andrew

Man you've got to take those crampons off before you get into bed .......sheesh all that protection and still punctured that would be really annoying.
Was the ground really rough/rocky or something?

I have a NeoAirXlite Women's and don't find noise an issue at all - are others in the NeoAir line noisy critters?
For added protection, If i can, I use either a piece of 3 mm foam (1/8 inch) http://gossamergear.com/sleeping/1-8.html under it, or the insulated foil stuff - I think it's the same as car window sunscreens, but ours are freeby pieces that were insulation surrounding chemotherapy drugs. The GG foam fits nicely as the back support in a GG Mariposa pack.
I also have womens' Prolite plus (shorter than the men's, and higher R value, but slight weight penalty, but I am a cold sleeper). http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Sleeping- ... us-WomensI feel it's more 'durable' than the NeoAirXlite and so use it for shorter walks, single nights etc. I find the NeoAir more comfy though.
Not tried an Exped UL Synmat for comparison sorry.

Off topic
PS Nemo 25inch Cosmo Pillowtop rectangular pad is great for car camping 7.5 cm (3") thick
810g without the microseude padded cover
http://www.campsaver.com/cosmo-air-pillow-top-combo
For a double one hubby and I have this http://www.backcountryedge.com/big_agne ... -2013.aspx, in a double Nemo pillowtop. 7.2 R value bliss
I gave up trying to cobble together separate mats for when we car camp. This and a double down quilt is just like a bed at home

PS here's a nice R value/thickness etc comparison chart i found for sleeping pads
http://sectionhiker.com/sleeping-pad-r-values/
and another
http://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/ ... gular.html

neilmny wrote:Would having a Tyvek footprint under the tent floor or even under the mat itself do the trick?

While tyvek itself is puncture resistant, is it actually thick enough to absorb and protect the mat from sharp objects?