Reducing Pack Weight

[corvus]

What could you leave out to reduce pack weight,keeping in mind comfort and safety.

[Nuts]

..

[alliecat]

Corvus,

Going through your complete gear list, these are the things I would leave behind:

Sleeping bag liner - I've just never used one
Thermal long johns - I'd wear the fleece pants instead. (I'd take either long johns or fleece pants, but not both).
Fresh wipes - if you've got sanitizer I think these are redundant
Towel and face washer - I use a bandana that I wear around my neck when walking.
Lantern - never used one
Medicinal liquids - Okay, I may take a small amount

So that's around a kilo, but most of that is in the lantern (+gas) and the booze which you might consider essential for comfort

I'm torn about the multitool. Sometimes I carry my old Swiss Army knife, sometimes a newer leatherman knife, sometimes nothing (there's a scalpel blade and a razor blade in my first aid kit). I feel nervous not having at least a knife, but it rarely gets used and when it does, honestly, the razor blade could have done the job. So that's a "maybe".

Looking at sthughes' list, I'd make sure I had fresh batteries for everything so I would leave the spares behind (but I'm not a GPS user, so what would I know...). I'd also say the pack liner, pack cover, and dry sacks are a bit of overkill - 2 out of 3 should suffice? But again, I'm not a pack cover user.

Other than those very few things, I think I carry everything you guys do.

Oh yeah, I'm vegetarian, so I'd leave out all the meat

Cheers,
Alliecat

[Son of a Beach]

I agree with most of alliecat's suggestions, but I would not go without both fleece pants and thermal long johns.

I frequently use both at the same time when walking (well, not when walking, but when camping). It gets cold enough often enough for me to need them both simultaneously. On rare occasions I've also work the waterproof trousers over the two of them in order to get a bit more warmth still (they cut the wind which makes a lot of difference, even in a gentle breeze).

The only things from my own kit that I would consider leaving out (and often do) are the camera and a book to read - oh and some of the luxury food/drinks that I sometimes take. Everything else in my own list, I consider to be essential.

[corvus]

No sleeping bag liner must = Rank, dirty,sleeping bag unless of course you dont sweat and ensure you shower b4 you retire for the night (gees they only weigh around 140 g) still to each their own and I will keep my bag clean by using a silk liner (wash and dry on extended walks with ease) still as said your choice

[corvus]

Corvus,

Going through your complete gear list, these are the things I would leave behind:


Fresh wipes - if you've got sanitizer I think these are redundant
Towel and face washer - I use a bandana that I wear around my neck when walking.




Cheers,
Alliecat

With respect how do you use sanitizer on your date? and with my sweatsoaked silk "bandana" I would be lucky to dry my left ear so how do you go about getting dry after a swim or a real wash makes your non sleeping bag liner sleeping bag sound even more rank
No disrespect intended but think about what you said :shock

[geoskid]

Corvus, Corvus, Corvus, - You just cant resist, if the pot is there you just have to stir it. You could leave all of your food at home bacause you are good at catching fish!

[geoskid]

Corvus,
Simple - get a lighter pack and put less in it! Comfort is an individual thing. Safety is an individual thing. This topic is the same fight just walking on the other side of the road.

[Darren]

Corvus
A persons comfort and safety can only be measured by the person themselves. As you have compiled your list on what you like you will easily be able to counter any suggestions made to you as you already have a reason you carry it.This is demonstrated in the previous posts.
Based on the fact you seem to be experienced, and with that you carry gear that achieves your level of comfort and safety based on your perception of what both those terms mean to you, I suggest you should not change anything. In reality you have asked a loaded question that only you can answer
Darren

[Son of a Beach]

how do you go about getting dry after a swim or a real wash

I drip/blow dry (if it's a warm day - which it usually is if I've gone for a swim) which really happens quite quickly, or sometimes I'll use whatever convenient item of clothing I have nearby that's not yet too filthy dirty/sweaty. Or sometimes I'll just get dressed while still a little wet, and I find that it dries (wicks?) off fairly quickly that way too.

[Tony]

Hi Corvus,

I would like to agree with Darren that

In reality you have asked a loaded question that only you can answer

I know in the past you usually dismissed my suggestions to reduce the weight in our pack as ‘hopelessly inadequate’. I would like to try and make another suggestion to you and all others on this site that are interested in lightening their load that you read this book "Lightweight Backpacking & Camping: A Field Guide to Wilderness Hiking Equipment, Technique, and Style which is available at http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin ... 00070.html its cost is only US$25 + shipping


Tony

[corvus]

Corvus, Corvus, Corvus, - You just cant resist, if the pot is there you just have to stir it. You could leave all of your food at home bacause you are good at catching fish!

geoskid,
You have me mixed up with fly fisher because if I had to rely on catching a fish to survive I would most probably starve

[corvus]

Hi Corvus,

I would like to agree with Darren that

In reality you have asked a loaded question that only you can answer

I know in the past you usually dismissed my suggestions to reduce the weight in our pack as ‘hopelessly inadequate’. I would like to try and make another suggestion to you and all others on this site that are interested in lightening their load that you read this book "Lightweight Backpacking & Camping: A Field Guide to Wilderness Hiking Equipment, Technique, and Style which is available at http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin ... 00070.html its cost is only US$25 + shipping


Tony

G'day Tony ,
Thanks for that information I really do look-into what you write and have been checking out LW gear for years ,we will most probably never agree but that is what makes us as individuals and helps to keep the forum lively
corvus.

[Franco]

Corvus
Not what you want to hear but your pack and your tent are relatively ( or according to some , incredibly) heavy.
Leaving over 7 day unsupported walks aside, a 70 l pack will do and you can have one for about 1.5kg ( or less) and still have a frame/hipbelt/load lifters and all of that. For example the 75 L ULA Catalyst, one of the favourite packs for the US long treks (PCT/Appalatian) . I would bet that with 15kg inside it will be as comfortable if not more so than your WE. Your pack liner also could be much lighter. Providing you don't plan to submerge your pack, a thick rubbish bag will do. I use the Paddy Pallin white bag because I have a few around (120g). The Microlite is not exactly light any longer. Again look at the Tarptent Rainbow, a very similar design to the Microlite,( same pole, similar fabric for the fly) it just does not have a inner, 930 g inc 6x pegs. In this case going to a single wall tent will reduce the condensation build up .(more headroom and floor space as well)

So
WE 90L pack 3100
Liner 346
Macpac tent 1863
__________
5309

ULA 75 L pack 1330
Liner 120
TT tent 930
___________
2380

saving 2929

That is almost 3kg with just 3 items....
Franco

[sthughes]

The Microlite is not exactly light any longer. Again look at the Tarptent Rainbow, a very similar design to the Microlite,( same pole, similar fabric for the fly) it just does not have a inner, 930 g inc 6x pegs. In this case going to a single wall tent will reduce the condensation build up .(more headroom and floor space as well)

You can pitch a Microlight without an inner and almost halve it's weight by doing so. Just pointing out this would make it close to the Rainbow weight anyway. Just depends if you like the bugs or not

Allicat - I agree I was VERY waterproof that trip (especially for summer!) - the pack cover was a bit of overkill! The dry bags (except the one I put my down gear in) are used outside the main pack compartment - one for my camera and phone (definatley required) and the other for my beanie, gloves etc. (could ditch). And I used all but the 3-AAA batteries and a couple of camera bateries - I agree I could forget the AAA's as an LED torch goes forever (well almost) on a fresh set.

I love my S2S pack liner (same as Corvus but a go fast red one!)- heavy but excellent. I used to use garbage bags and still would on an overnighter but they just tear so easily and you always have to be careful so on a three nighter it's nice to have the peace of mind. They would make an excellent 3/4 length bivvy in an emergency to.

Corvus - you could ditch the lantern, the extra billy/cup and get a proper spoon . But it wouldn't be as nice without group light and would be inconvienient not having the second billy and a spoon with which to pry open padlocks and lever up large boulders should you need to

[Tony]

Hi Corvus

Thankyou for your reply, I agree that we most probably never agree.

G'day Tony ,
Thanks for that information I really do look-into what you write and have been checking out LW gear for years ,we will most probably never agree but that is what makes us as individuals and helps to keep the forum lively
corvus.

These few suggestion are not aimed only at Corvus's gear but is information for any BW-T forum members who are thinking about reducing the weight in their pack.

One of the most important tricks in reducing pack weight is not taking anything you will not use or any more of something that you need.

CAUTION: THESE SUGGESTIONS WILL NOT REDUCE SAFETY IN ANY WAY.

eg SUNSCREEN 88g, do you need 88g of sunscreen, I take a small container that full weighs in at 13g, this amount has lasted more that three days with some left. You could not use 88g of sunscreen in under several weeks walking if 13g is too small use a slightly larger container but only take what you will need.

BUSMAN 80% Deet Repellent 79g, the same as above 13g

FRESH WIPES 53g, the same as above, I take 13g of soap and with careful use it has lasted me 5 days.

MULTITOOL 168g, I have carried the smallest Swiss army knife (21.1g) for 4 years now and I rarely use it, I do not know why you have the need for a 168g multi tool

This is a saving of 328g on these items alone.

Tony


Sunscreen, insect repellant, soap and knife around 60g total

[Son of a Beach]

One of the most important tricks in reducing pack weight is not taking anything you will not use or any more of something that you need.

Do you mean 'anything you will not use' or 'anything you would not use in emergencies'?

I take 13g of soap and with careful use it has lasted me 5 days.

Soap is 'frowned upon' by some environmentalists. I never take any soap or detergent. Maybe that's why my wife insists on me going straight to the shower when I arrive home for a walk. So I save 13g more than you on something - that's a first!

[sthughes]

I was just thinking what Tony said (wow we agree ) I also thought about it just before I left for the walk too but just didn't have time or any containers - but I do agree and if I see some suitable containers will probably do it. I like the scissors and pliers on my pocket knife but can see both are luxuries.
I use special biodegradable wilderness washing liquid stuff (useless at cutting through grease however) - that's ok isn't it? (If not sorry for killing the Mersey River creatures )

[Tony]

Hi Nik,

="Son of a Beach
Do you mean 'anything you will not use' or 'anything you would not use in emergencies'?

What do you take in case of emergency, This is a debate in its self, many walkers take stuff just in case, I have walked with people that take three knifes and some that have taken three souces of light plus emergency candle. I think common sense should apply.

Soap is 'frowned upon' by some environmentalists. I never take any soap or detergent. Maybe that's why my wife insists on me going straight to the shower when I arrive home for a walk. So I save 13g more than you on something - that's a first!

What do you do for personal hygene after going to the toilet.

Like sthughes I use special wilderness wash and always wash away from streams using the minimal amount of water, often no soap contaminated water enters the ecosystem. And like you I keep my body washes to a minimium and I am also ushered straight into the shower when I get home.

Tony

[Nuts]

..

[Franco]

Corvus
Not exactly. The Rainbow is fully bug proof and has a protected entry with a full mesh door. So you can still enjoy the view but keep the bugs out.
Have a good look at the set-up, including the "product update 08 pics. ( I have the original version)
Franco

[Tony]

Hi sthughes,

I was just thinking what Tony said (wow we agree ) I also thought about it just before I left for the walk too but just didn't have time or any containers - but I do agree and if I see some suitable containers will probably do it. I like the scissors and pliers on my pocket knife but can see Hi both are luxuries.
I use special biodegradable wilderness washing liquid stuff (useless at cutting through grease however) - that's ok isn't it? (If not sorry for killing the Mersey River creatures )

Thanks for agreeing with me it is rare on BW-T

Waterproof Gaffa Tape 88

Another tip

I have no idea what you would do with 88g of gaffa tape, it would be enough to tape a awfull lot of heals or repair a lot tears in WP layers or repair a lot of broken straps etc, I take gaffa tape but a much smaller amount usually wraped arround my walking pole or something else, I have used this tape once recently when I lost my UL rod tube in some thick srub, I used the tape to tape my rod together for some protection.

I got my small containers from BPL http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin ... orted.html US$8.59 but I found that the hole in the tip was a bit small for the viscous liquids that I was trying to squeeze out especially when cold, I solved this problem by drilling the hole out a little bit, works fine now.

Tony

[corvus]

Corvus
Not exactly. The Rainbow is fully bug proof and has a protected entry with a full mesh door. So you can still enjoy the view but keep the bugs out.
Have a good look at the set-up, including the "product update 08 pics. ( I have the original version)
Franco

G'day Franco,
I think this was meant for sthughes as I have not commented on the rainbow but I will check it out

[Franco]

Hi Corvus
You know about assuming...
I thought that it was you talking about your Microlite.
Maybe Sthughes should also look at that link...
Whilst Tony was busy looking at the smaller bits, I thought I just go for the more obvious larger ones.
Keep in mind that there are many lighter solution still, for example my 5 day pack and tent are about 700g lighter than the ones suggested but not as versatile or as easy going from what you have now. And of course I could also lose some weight, but I do like my comforts.
BTW, I hope that people don't take to suggestion as if someone told you that your dog is ugly, but you are either happy with what you have or you want to "lighten up" and sometime that really means lightening up in more ways than one.

Often the problem with Tarptents is that people have no idea at all of what they look like or how they perform, they just get stuck on the name.
From memory not long ago some could not get passed the Toy part of Toyota, including most US manufacturers. Things change.

Franco

[corvus]

Hi Corvus

Thankyou for your reply, I agree that we most probably never agree.


These few suggestion are not aimed only at Corvus's gear but is information for any BW-T forum members who are thinking about reducing the weight in their pack.

One of the most important tricks in reducing pack weight is not taking anything you will not use or any more of something that you need.

CAUTION: THESE SUGGESTIONS WILL NOT REDUCE SAFETY IN ANY WAY.

eg SUNSCREEN 88g, do you need 88g of sunscreen, I take a small container that full weighs in at 13g, this amount has lasted more that three days with some left. You could not use 88g of sunscreen in under several weeks walking if 13g is too small use a slightly larger container but only take what you will need.
BUSMAN 80% Deet Repellent 79g, the same as above 13g
FRESH WIPES 53g, the same as above, I take 13g of soap and with careful use it has lasted me 5 days.
MULTITOOL 168g, I have carried the smallest Swiss army knife (21.1g) for 4 years now and I rarely use it, I do not know why you have the need for a 168g multi tool

This is a saving of 328g on these items alone.

Tony


Sunscreen, insect repellant, soap and knife around 60g total

G'day Tony,
SUNSCREEN 88g includes the container and in the past I have used film can type containers -so yes I agree

BUSHMAN 80% DEET in leech country (all of Tassie) you need to apply it liberally to gaiters and legs so IMHO 13g would just not hack it (also I would be concerned as to what sort of container I used ) eats plastics I'm told -so disagree

FRESH WIPES Only used for the most intimate of cleansing which soap nor sanitizer would perform -so disagree

MULTITOOL OK have never needed to use it since I decided that I was not Mr Fix it for everyone on the track so yes it can be ditched -so agree

Mini Swiss Army Knife on to my third one in 25 years and I would use it at least once a day (tooth pick, scissors, nailfile and on occasions knife blade) never leave home without mine my second best friend

So Tony we agree on two out of four

[Tony]

Hi corvus,

So Tony we agree on two out of four

I am stunned

BUSHMAN 80% DEET in leech country (all of Tassie) you need to apply it liberally to gaiters and legs so IMHO 13g would just not hack it (also I would be concerned as to what sort of container I used ) eats plastics I'm told -so disagree

So you are saying that you use 80g of deet everytime you go walking. There are larger containers than I use available. the DEET that I use comes in a plastic tube, many walkers in the US use these containers for DEET and I have not read any problems with them, time will tell if the plastic bottles that I use will last.
Have your gaiters suffered any damage from applying DEET to them

FRESH WIPES Only used for the most intimate of cleansing which soap nor sanitizer would perform -so disagree

that is your personal preference, at least you know a lighter sanitation option is availabe.

Tony

[Son of a Beach]

Hi Nik,

="Son of a Beach
Do you mean 'anything you will not use' or 'anything you would not use in emergencies'?

What do you take in case of emergency, This is a debate in its self, many walkers take stuff just in case, I have walked with people that take three knifes and some that have taken three souces of light plus emergency candle. I think common sense should apply.

Sorry Tony, I wasn't having a go, and did not mean to start (another) debate on what is suitable for an emergency. I just wanted to clarify whether or not you were only taking the things that you know for sure you will use on this trip, or whether you take items that you may or may not use. Just semantics, but it sounded like the former.

Soap is 'frowned upon' by some environmentalists. I never take any soap or detergent. Maybe that's why my wife insists on me going straight to the shower when I arrive home for a walk. So I save 13g more than you on something - that's a first!

What do you do for personal hygene after going to the toilet.

Toilet paper. Or snow. Then I wash my hands in water, the same as in the bathroom at home. I don't poop on my hands - at least not yet - and I don't know how you guys end up with your hands in need of disinfecting so frequently.

I guess nobody from this forum is ever going to want to shake hands with me now?

Like sthughes I use special wilderness wash and always wash away from streams using the minimal amount of water, often no soap contaminated water enters the ecosystem. And like you I keep my body washes to a minimium and I am also ushered straight into the shower when I get home.

Tony

Oh, yes, I would also dump the DEET. I rarely take any insect repellant, and never worry about leech repellant. Yes, I have had many leeches on one or two walks, and one or two leeches on many walks, but I guess the endless bleeding and itching doesn't bother me as much as some people (yes, I hate leeches, but I just can't be bothered adding something else to my pack... I guess my laziness is even greater than my revulsion of them). Occasionally I use insect repellant, but usually forget it, as I've never added it to my 'official' list of things to pack. I just wear long sleeves, at camp and get by with a few mozzie and march fly bites here and there.

So that's a few more grams you could save there, Tony.

[sthughes]

Corvus
Not exactly. The Rainbow is fully bug proof and has a protected entry with a full mesh door. So you can still enjoy the view but keep the bugs out.
Have a good look at the set-up, including the "product update 08 pics. ( I have the original version)
Franco

Lol - yes it was me! But I meant the microlight could be lighter if you were happy to cop the bugs - yep the rainbow is bug proof of course.

[corvus]

Hi corvus,

So Tony we agree on two out of four

I am stunned



So you are saying that you use 80g of deet everytime you go walking. There are larger containers than I use available. the DEET that I use comes in a plastic tube, many walkers in the US use these containers for DEET and I have not read any problems with them, time will tell if the plastic bottles that I use will last.
Have your gaiters suffered any damage from applying DEET to them

FRESH WIPES Only used for the most intimate of cleansing which soap nor sanitizer would perform -so disagree

that is your personal preference, at least you know a lighter sanitation option is availabe.

Tony

G'day Tony,
DEET 80% I dont use all of the 79g (last time I used 12g ) but prefer not run out so your 13g may be on the money - so sort of agree but still wary of transferring it to an alternate container.
I use HD Canvas Gaiters and they dont show any sign of damage (cotton being a natural material just like my skin)

FRESH WIPES how exactly do you propose I easily cleanse the "date" with soap or sanitizer(comfort is my criteria)
when it comes down to it we are talking about grammes overall my current used pkt weighs 33g which is equivalent to a mouthful of water.
corvus

[corvus]

Hi Corvus
You know about assuming...
BTW, I hope that people don't take to suggestion as if someone told you that your dog is ugly, but you are either happy with what you have or you want to "lighten up" and sometime that really means lightening up in more ways than one.


Franco

G'day Franco,
First lesson when I arrived in Tassie 40 years ago NEVER ASSUME and what if your dog had no nose ? how would it smell ? so in keeping with your thoughts if I were to "lighten up" any further I would float into the ether
c