Aussie made gear - what's its cost versus imported

[taswegian]

I have an old Mountain Design polarfleece jacket made in Australia. A few years back I bought a similar one but that was 'designed in Australia'.
Today I looked at getting another similar to my lighter weight original Mountain Design Aus made one.

I'm wondering just how much difference the price would be if they were made here as opposed to importing?

What I find disappointing is manufacturers needing some equipment, go offshore to get something made in China, bring it home then start to produce goods for our market and expect us to buy their goods when we could quite easily do what they did and just buy 'their' product that is made with Chinese equipment directly from China.
(and in some instances imported Chinese labour to put it togther here)

This is not a rant against any nationality - I was made in and lived in Asia for a while so reckon that qualifies me to make these comments.
But I'm an Oz through and through and just believe in our own abilities to make stuff.

[Franco]

A factory worker in China makes 300-400 AUD per month.
For that he will work 26 to 30 days .
If you can get me a workforce like that, I will consider starting a factory here.

BTW, if you can get me capable staff that takes US wages and conditions and electricity/taxes/postage/rents and stock costs on a par with the US, I will also think about starting a retail shop here to compete with the US guys...
Franco

[Drifting]

Yeah- our Govt' and economy aren't really kind to retail. I bought almost our whole kit (for 3) from the US INCLUDING a Hilleberg tent for less than 1 person's kit in Australia.

[Rob A]

A lot of the (top end) stuff you buy in hiking shops comes from either vietnam (tents) or the phillipines (packs, gaiters) because you wont pay what it cost for someone to make them in a first world country. Im not really sure where workers in those countries would ever get two of three hundred bucks a month. These days people wont even pay what it costs to keep a store open. Theyd rather 'not getting ripped off for busness costs' by shopping on line.

[jacko1956]

I rather think it's a catch 22 situation.
I, like many, would happily pay more for "made in Australia".
But Australia doesn't manufacture anymore.
The consumer quite rightly wonders why they should pay much higher prices for the same Asian made goods.
Keeping retail staff employed doesn't have the same patriot appeal as keeping manufacturing going (apologies to shop staff out there but it isn't the same).
The biggest problem with Australia is that we don't "value add" to anything we export.
We sell iron ore not steel. We sell wool not clothing. etc etc...
I have a ULA Circit backpack and a Henry Shires Tarptent. Both were purchased from small producers in the US not because of price (although it wasn't a bad price), but because they suited my needs. They were both made by very small players in the scheme of things. If similar products were made in Australia I would have bought here.
I think the internet provides the opportunity for small players to compete by providing a better suited product.
Whilst nearly everything sold in a hiking store is made in Vietnam, China or another asian country, I will continue to look for other options. In the case of tents as an example, the tarptent won my money because of it's length. It may just be that in a country like Vietnam an extra 20cm of length may not seem necessary but for people 30cm taller than a Vietnamese average it certainly does.

[Ent]

Hi

A major issue with gear is category killer retail shops chasing the highest margins. You will see reputable brands been replaced by inhouse items made to the cheapest cost. This also means one size fits all approach as container load volumes are needed to make this retail model work.

This basic question is bushwalking a specialist market or is it a mass market? Years ago it was specialist market so stuff cost heaps but was built to very high standards. It could be argued that the category killers are looking upon bushwalking as an extension to the mass travel market.

As for the age old retail whinge that labour, rates, rent, etc are to high I find this without merit. Travelers to Germany and Japan will find local extremely well made items in those country's stores. The big issue is capital expenditure is excessively controlled by management due mainly to the high cost of financing so production facilities are obsolete. China has some very impressive state of the art machinery. Sure there are a few sweat shops but lot if their advantage is modern production lines.

The future is direct sales over the Internet. This means that retailers will be under further pressure but that is evolution as craft industries were replaced by the industrial revolution.

If we are honest most of us that are gear freaks spend a lot of time online looking for our "perfect" solution and as a result have better knowledge than a retailer. This means a local store looks rather average unless it specializes in high end gear. Passion 8 is a good example. This will mean that there is only room for one or two shops rather than the massive number. Launceston has population of around 80,000 so taking in every hamlet and town maybe 160,000 people. It has eight shops competing. Years ago there was three so you have a crowded market of me-to products where margins count.

The Internet means local specialized retailers can now bypass mass market retail thinking so get ready for a gradual increase in local products as what is happening in the USA.

Cheers

[wayno]

thanks to sites like this one, and online hiking gear sites, a novice shoppping for gear can get an idea of what is truly good gear and go and find it if they are willing to do their homework and not get sucked in by marketing hype.... ie if it sounds too good to be true it probably is...
i still buy from shops , but if the price difference between a shop and online gets too big i'll get it online.. i recently saved. $120 online on a jacket that was retailing here for $250, and that takes the shipping fee into consideration as well. in a single year the no of privately bought packages brought into australia from overseas
went up by 30%

[taswegian]

I guess the bottom line after quality comes down to price for most people.

But I would like to know (for egs) what my Mountain Design Jacket of 2000? would cost now if made fully in Australia from quality material and zips against what an imported equivalent, badged by Mountain Design as 'Designed in Australia' as is my 2007 version.

We can chose to buy Aussie made but marketing doesn't support that very well.
Food is a classic egs, but what really opened my eyes was when asked recently to take on a job I knew very well they didn't need my 'expertise' to get something through Council to the completion stage.
It turned out after a fair bit of dodging and ducking the bloke was using a Chinese architect who in turn deisgned prefabriacted units that would arrive fully fitted and serviced and all ready to drop onto a foundation. And those units would be all the way from China.

I guess most (or many?) city dwellers would know little if anything about how we get milk or butter onto the table yet alone how a tent or jacket or pack is made and are probably horified about what we do to our forests and the poor animals we ship off to other countries. And then one day they wonder why they haven't a job because someone in China or India or other overseas market has displaced them.

I'm a firm believer we can make a difference but only if we care enough about outcomes that affect others, our own kids even.

I have bought overseas but gear (for work) not available here. And I fully appreciate some of the comments regarding overseas made to order gear that is of the highest quality and is custom made.
Guess what comes round goes round. Just depends how big the circumference is I imagine.

[wayno]

massive problems in nz with large no's of housing designs made in the states for cladding buildings,,, those designs were for dry areas of the states, bring them here and all the moisure in nz combined with the fact that the least skilled labour is involved in sealing the cladding and timber manufacturers who managed to get untanalised timber made legal and you ended up with thousands of houses and apartments that just rotted over the years.... they still havent seen all the faulty ouses yet, plenty made in drier areas that are just rotting more slowly and havent showed up on the radar yet....
reminds me of an osprey day pack i bought.... it didnt close off at the top of the water bladder sleeve and there was no coating on the nylon between the sleeve and the main pack compartment, so when it rained the water could just pur into the pack,,,, speaks to me of a pack made in and or for a dry part of the states....

[taswegian]

Right!! Not related directly but. And it has made me rethink how and why we buy on-line.

I wanted something from a local leading supplier and one that I admire and respect and who also plies a good deal of money into making life more comfortable for bushwalkers.
Well it turns out its not in stock (I had bought 2 such items earlier in year) and I had to go into the store to order and also pay a deposit. (I remember that from last time only that time I was actually standing in the store and so paid full amount and went on my way).
I asked over phone if I could pay via card. No! By bank transfer - No!

I saw they had a mail order department and asked about that. That didn't lead anywhere.

Upshot is I rang the supplier in Victoria and they suggested I go elsewhere and gave me a couple of names.

I found I could also order and pay on line from faceless people that said they were in Australia and pay $10 and it would be posted to my door.

Is it little wonder we are bemoaning how we don't get service these days and shopkeepers bemoan why we customers chose on-line versus over the counter.
Dickyboy has gone down a rung in my esteem for his business side of things.
Another Dickyboy's thoughts for Monday.

[climberman]

As I heard a manufacturer say the other day... "No-one wants to pay $1000 for a $450 jacket". If they could sell em they'd sell em. You are the market.

[taswegian]

Except in this instance all I wanted to do was order something and buy local and pay the same price I would On-Line.
Actually could be argued more if I included the postage.
It just didn't make sense to me especially knowing the store owner himself (the Big Boss) battles with the unseen and faceless shopping society many choose as their way of purchase.
Pot calling kettle black? boot on other foot?

[clarence]

The cost of Australian manufactured items is not necessarily that high.

I buy all my work clothes from an Australian manufacturer (Tuffa) and they are less expensive than the identical asian made items from King Gee or Yakka in a retail store (I would rather support an Australian manufacturer than an Australian retailer selling imported product).

On the outdoors front, there is simply not the range that was once available in locally made gear. In the 90s you could get a complete kit of world class quality items made in Australia (WE packs, jackets, tents, MONT jackets and sleeping bags, ONE PLANET ditto, CIGANA clothes, OUTGEAR packs, even BOGONG boots- okay maybe they were not totally world class). If you included the NZ brands, the choice was exceptional.

HOWEVER, there still is a reasonable range available, provided you know where to look.

I buy most of my clothing from WILDERNESS WEAR. Wide range, nice fabrics, good quality and very reasonable prices. Go online to one of their sales and be very surprised. I had a made to measure SUMMIT GEAR pack from the Blue Mountains a few years back. It fitted like a glove, was light and bombproof and cost $100 more than the equivalent Macpac at the time. Their ability to customise gear is something you will not get from an imported product, and their off-the-shelf items are as good as anything else you would find. My last sleeping bag was a ONE PLANET (still made in Australia at that time) and it was about $80 more than the imported item of "similar" quality.

Add to this the NZ manufacturers (EARTH SEA and SKY, CACTUS and for bike related gear GROUND EFFECT) and there is a not unreasonable choice.

Last week I picked up some made in Australia socks and NZ made gloves from MD in Hobart. Locally made gear is around if you look.

Rather than complain about the problem, why not seek out the locally made product and share your experiences for the benefit of others. The gear is out there at reasonable prices (as long as you don't base "reasonable" on a price comparison with Kathmandu rubbish).

Clarence

[cdg]

I cant express how disappointed i was when i went to replace my Wilderness Equipment pack, with a new one and discovered they were now made in vietnam.