Falls Creek to Mt Hotham Alpine Crossing

[neilmny]

Stry,
There was a lot of very new shiny signs for the original Falls to Hotham walk. Could what you saw have been those.
They've been around for a couple of years now.

An example - at Cope Hut camping platforms. There was larger signs "announcing" the walk at various places such as on the west side of the road near the Cope Hut car park.

Falls Hotham_1.JPG (178.2 KiB) Viewed 32554 times

[Moondog55]

There is always the option of naplam fellers; in winter of course
PV were never ever going to listen to any objections, they never do
I've done Diamantina Spur, I must have been fitter in those days because I do not remember it as being all that steep

[Xplora]

The original Falls to Hotham crossing starts at Heathy Spur and then onto the Big River Firetrail, Marrum point to Wallaces. The new plan will cut most of that out. They will also then have to erect newer shiny signs to cut out the Dibbins Hut reference. There is still some nice camping 100m away from the platforms at Cope. I also know people within PV who are privately objecting to the new plan.

[paidal_chalne_vala]

Mr Xplora ,you know them or "no them "?

[Xplora]

Mr Xplora ,you know them or "no them "?

Sometimes my brain and fingers get confused. My fingers think they are in charge. Thanks. Sorted.

[Xplora]

Just found this but it is too late.
https://www.aila.org.au/iMIS_Prod/AILAW ... 5fe691b1d1

Is this about 'Valuing the Landscape' or 'Value adding'. Opening line - "AILA will be hosting a panel discussion on “Landscape as a key economic and tourism driver for State Governments” Interpreted as 'How to exploit the landscape so greedy people can make more money'. One of the key note speakers was the Landscape architect heading the team for this program.

[north-north-west]

'Landscape Architect'? What the *&%$#! blue blazes does that even mean? Makes it sound lile they want to demolish and then reconstruct the terrain to something a little more 'user friendly'.

[Lophophaps]

'Landscape Architect'? What the *&%$#! blue blazes does that even mean? Makes it sound lile they want to demolish and then reconstruct the terrain to something a little more 'user friendly'.

What it means is that PV has lost the plot. However, having lost the plot the landscape artist can plant flowers to make the place look beautiful. Begonias, roses, oak trees, pencil pine are under consideration, to provide shelter for the sheep and cattle. These are people who walk from Falls Creek to Hotham. Not the other way of course, too hard to read the instructions.

[north-north-west]

Instructions? I thought they just followed the guides (with the occasional 'baaaaaaa' and regular breaks to browse on the clover).

Oh no, now I see: they'll have specially trained kelpies to take the punters through. Droving, Australian Alps style - through the sheeps' eyes.

[Xplora]

And now this I found by accident date 2012 http://planningschemes.dpcd.vic.gov.au/ ... 2_alpr.pdf

just a brief extract

Conserving and protecting the natural environmental systems and landscape values
within and adjacent to the Resort so as to minimise the disturbance to flora and fauna
communities and to areas of high scenic quality or visual sensitivity.

unless this interferes with our ability to turn a dollar.

It has been suggested there will be no snow on the mountain by 2050 so why are they encouraging further development in the resort? There are so many lodges for sale so why do they need to build more? I know the resorts are investing in new snow making technology and that will be the only thing to keep them alive. They have a rule that any new building cannot obstruct the view of the ski fields. What happens outside the resort matters less to them.

[Lophophaps]

Instructions? I thought they just followed the guides (with the occasional 'baaaaaaa' and regular breaks to browse on the clover).

Oh no, now I see: they'll have specially trained kelpies to take the punters through. Droving, Australian Alps style - through the sheeps' eyes.

LOL. Maybe electric fences to keep out the wildlife, such as bushwalkers.

Conserving and protecting the natural environmental systems and landscape values within and adjacent to the Resort so as to minimise the disturbance to flora and fauna
communities and to areas of high scenic quality or visual sensitivity.

unless this interferes with our ability to turn a dollar.

It has been suggested there will be no snow on the mountain by 2050 so why are they encouraging further development in the resort? ... What happens outside the resort matters less to them.

In my view PV have breached their duty of care and their overall goal - to preserve national parks in as natural a state as possible. Regardless of the year, the length of usable snow cover will decrease, and at some stage a resort will not be viable because there will simply not be enough snow for enough skiers to cover fixed costs. Due to the wrong sort of weather being more frequesnt, and maybe less water, snow making is going to be limited. Also, due to less snow cover the snow making fixed costs will be hard to meet. I keep going back to economics, return on investment, net profit after tax and all that.

The focus has been on short-term issues, immediate profit, with scant regard for the more distant future. In many parts of my life I seek a balance between short-, medium- and long-term goals. The long-term goals may be beyond my life. There's portion of a poem that sums it up:
I'm only a boy from the bush near Fitzroy,
And I don't understand people's games.
But I just want to know where our children will go,
When none of our bushland remains.

Any answers? Lake Pedder, Tarkine, seeing Leadbeater's Possum?

I'm advised that PV was meant to have a Falls-Hotham plan including the December submissions out by about now. I've asked PV for a month about a few things but am getting the same answer - no reply. Does anyone know what is happening and when?

PV say:
"There are two campsites on the Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing: Cope Hut Campsite, amongst the snowgums on the Bogong High Plains, is 14km from the trailhead and usually the first night's campsite. Dibbins Hut Campsite is on a snowgrass plain near the headwaters of the Cobungra River.
A permit is required to camp at the Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing campsites."
Confusingly, this refers to the existing Falls-Hotham walk, via Dibbins. I think that the advice about camping on the "Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing campsites" is accurate in that it refers to the platforms. But it seems misleading in that I believe that camping 100 metres or more away does not attract a fee or require a permit.

Is the PV advice misleading and is a permit needed for camping away from the platforms at Cope and Dibbins Huts?

[north-north-west]

I'm only a boy from the bush near Fitzroy,
And I don't understand people's games.
But I just want to know where our children will go,
When none of our bushland remains.

They'll be safely inside, wired up to their virtual reality Outdoor Experience - no sweat, no pain, no rain, no mud, no scrub.

[Xplora]

Is the PV advice misleading and is a permit needed for camping away from the platforms at Cope and Dibbins Huts?

No permit or booking required to camp 100m or more away. There are plenty of good spots outside the permit required area especially at Dibbins. This may change once the commercial interests take over. They will not like to see people pitching tents and not paying as the paying guests will work out they have been ripped off. Dibbins will also be on the alternate route anyway if the Diamantina spur idea goes ahead.

[paidal_chalne_vala]

The Diamantina spur idea is the most insane thing the "Yes minister" crowd have cooked up for ages. The wording about the platforms means PV and the rangers don't have to police it. Nobody camps on the platforms at Dibbin's hut. They camp by hut !!! . It is free and it is most pleasant.

[Xplora]

In the latest edition of Wild magazine there is a short piece about this proposal with the web address for comment. Some small errors in the piece. Not sure who sent it in or if it originated from the editorial desk but all a bit late for comment. It may still raise awareness though.

[Lophophaps]

I put a number of questions and statements to Parks Victoria. One statement said:
"While you need a permit to camp at the camping platforms, you can camp at Dibbins or any place without a permit."
There was no reply to this, nor would I expect one unless I was incorrect. As PV did not contradict me I think it's reasonable to conclude that my statement is correct. That is, away from the camping platforms you can camp without a permit. Clarification is being sought.

The other answers or non-answers (much of my report did not lead to a response) are more or less what we have at present. For example, I mentioned a hut or standing camp on the Razorback. PV said "Works within the conservation zone are acceptable so long as they meet the requirements of that zone." Fair enough, but what if the hut or camp is in breach of the zone? The proposed Diamantina Spur track "Importantly it creates the opportunity to visit Feathertop." Funny, I've been up and down Feathertop five ways, six counting skis. Seven counting face plants.

I said that the walk does not start at Falls Creek. PV said "The preliminary concept suggests a range of different ways in which walkers may get to the starting point at Wallaces Hut, where it proposes the world-class experience starts."

PV is looking at more questions, and I'll advise if anything of substance emerges. I asked when the next report would be availablae and there was no response.

[Xplora]

I put a number of questions and statements to Parks Victoria. One statement said:
"While you need a permit to camp at the camping platforms, you can camp at Dibbins or any place without a permit."
There was no reply to this, nor would I expect one unless I was incorrect. As PV did not contradict me I think it's reasonable to conclude that my statement is correct. That is, away from the camping platforms you can camp without a permit. Clarification is being sought.

From my friend in PV who looks after the bookings for these platforms, you can pitch a tent 100m away from a platform and not pay but any closer requires payment. Perhaps it would be good to clarify what the requirements of the conservation zone are. Is that available without having to ask them and get another non response? If questions are not being answered then it is within your rights to complain to the Ombudsman.

[Lophophaps]

PV decline at this stage to clarify the camping aspects. I'm still hopeful that PV will advise me of the details.

The date of the process has been pushed back. The original PV information said that the Draft master plan would be available by Sepeter 2015-January 2016. See
http://parkweb.vic.gov.au/explore/parks ... aster-plan
which says it will be September/October 2016. The delay is understandable - PV has lost staff, government cutbacks.
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/victo ... lsfv0.html

I just picked up an amazing typo. The original PV documentation has an "existing track" (a solid green line) across Rocky Valley Dam, walk three.

Rocky Valley Dam walk

Rocky.png (231.22 KiB) Viewed 31847 times

Oops. There's still the problem that a walk billed as starting at Falls starts near Wallaces, and has the same name as an existing walk.

[Mark F]

That must be the JC shortcut or else climate change will reduce rainfall in the area to 0.

[sim1oz]

Ha Ha, Mark, my thoughts exactly. We 'walked on water' on the Glenelg River because the water level was slightly above the jetty at one campsite - maybe PV are thinking of an underwater bridge...

[Lophophaps]

That must be the JC shortcut or else climate change will reduce rainfall in the area to 0.

LOL! My understanding is that parks Victoria are going to call the route from Falls Creek to the south shore the Tony Abbott track.

[Xplora]

I might start a paddle boat hire for those of us who are less divine.

[Lophophaps]

I might start a paddle boat hire for those of us who are less divine.

LOL! Here's one that blends in:

Parks Victoria design for Rocky Valley Dam paddle boat

[paidal_chalne_vala]

The Messiah will come again trek over the Rocky Valley dam surface .......... not so holy people should walk around the lake instead.

[Lophophaps]

The Preliminary Concept Plan says:
""The Environmental Risk Assessment highlighted that the proposed route would not significantly impact the surrounding landscape provided the management recommendations proposed in the plan are fully implemented."
See the text towards the top right in:
http://parkweb.vic.gov.au/__data/assets ... oncept.pdf
The proposed new tracks are quite distinct from new camping areas and new huts. Parks Victoria is silent on this point. At the risk of repeating myself, The Razorback, Feathertop and Diamantina Spur to within 600 metres distance of the bottom are in a conservation zone.

Does anyone known if the Environmental Risks Assessment is a public document? If so, advice about where it can be found would be useful. Thanks.

[paidal_chalne_vala]

The VNPA have run a small article about this issue in the current " Park watch " colour VNPA quarterly magazine.

[Xplora]

I might start a paddle boat hire for those of us who are less divine.

LOL! Here's one that blends in:

Paddle boat.jpg

Do they come in black?

[Lophophaps]

Do they come in black?

Yes.

Black swan.jpg (13.32 KiB) Viewed 31589 times

The bridge in the background is similar to the one I proposed from above Westons Hut to The Razorback, making Diamantina Spur much easier. I'm waiting on advice from Parks Victoria about this.

[neilmny]

Wouldn't it be better to have a gondola with swans hanging from a cable, a lot cheaper than a stone bridge.................come to think of it there could be a drag line all the way around...across the lake the whole works.........quite the wilderness experience........

[scroggin]

I put a number of questions and statements to Parks Victoria. One statement said:
"While you need a permit to camp at the camping platforms, you can camp at Dibbins or any place without a permit."
There was no reply to this, nor would I expect one unless I was incorrect. As PV did not contradict me I think it's reasonable to conclude that my statement is correct. That is, away from the camping platforms you can camp without a permit. Clarification is being sought.

From my friend in PV who looks after the bookings for these platforms, you can pitch a tent 100m away from a platform and not pay but any closer requires payment. Perhaps it would be good to clarify what the requirements of the conservation zone are. Is that available without having to ask them and get another non response? If questions are not being answered then it is within your rights to complain to the Ombudsman.

Looks like the platforms are sold out for this coming long weekend, would love to be able to tell them that they don't need to pay.

http://www.parkstay.vic.gov.au/falls-to ... e-crossing