"Being prepared" in the electronic age

[GPSGuided]

Okay you're splitting hairs now. We could turn this into a detailed technical discussion but I don't see the point. Maybe in another thread if people wanna go down that path? I am aware of the capabilities and limitations of this device. I've outlined how I go about using the SPOT Satellite GPS Messenger above. If you see somewhere I can improve on that please let me know.

This is hardly splitting hair. SPOT does not use the constellation of GPS satellites but its own set of commercial communication satellites with restricted global coverage. It has nothing to do with how you use the device, bread crumbs or not. When you are out of SPOT's satellite coverage area, you are out and there's no crumb. GPS has true global coverage with its 24 satellite constellation while COSPAS-SARSAT (used by PLBs) comes very close if not full coverage. So, the statement "if you can get a GPS signal for mapping you can get a message out on the Spot Satellite GPS messenger" is undeniably false.

[photohiker]

One high profile Adventurer's thought's on GPS mapping units for use in the field:

Why backcountry GPS units are overrated

http://andrewskurka.com/2012/why-backco ... overrated/

Lets look at Andrew's main points:

I struggle to describe GPS units as anything more than “gadgets.”

A map and compass is more reliable:

No batteries
No electronics that can malfunction
No screen that can break or freeze up in cold temperatures

With a map and compass I can do everything that a GPS can do:

Pinpoint my location to a relevant degree of accuracy (maybe not within 3 meters, but I’ve never needed to know my route within three meters anyway), by paying attention to my pace and surrounding landmarks
Determine the distance and direction to my next destination
Mark my route, by writing on the map with a pen
Share my route virtually, by re-drawing it in TOPO! and/or Google Maps, or converting my TOPO! file to a .kml file (Google Maps) via GPSbabel freeware.

And, in fact, with a map and compass I can do even more:

Identify the path of least resistance to my next destination, unlike a GPS which can only tell me the distance and direction. Whereas a GPS might send me across a canyon or lake, into the thickest brush, and through a series of pointless ups-and-downs (PUDS), by reading the map I can avoid all of that.

Apart from the battery/breakage issues, I can't help wondering if Andrew has really tried to use GPS effectively. Perhaps his points have more merit on an unplanned walk where the path taken is decided on the fly, but there are several GPS these days with effective on the fly, on screen planning. His suggestion that a GPS is incapable of identifying the path of least resistance suggests that he may not have been using the right kind of mapping on his GPS either. Perhaps, for some of the places he goes the right kind of mapping is not available, but I would suggest that for most of us it is.

The battery/breakage issues require planning to minimise. In all my walking with GPS, I have never managed to break the GPS or to run out of batteries or to have the unit die on me. Counting back, I think I have had about 7 different GPS units since I started using them, not including smartphone apps which I regard as backups, not main GPS.

Andrew's best point is where he declares his preference for maps because "viewing an 11″x17″ map is much more pleasant than a 3″x4″ LCD screen, plus the expense and unreliability of said map packages."

I take maps anyway, so I have the benefit of using both technologies and the large map when required. I have found that using OSM mapping removes much of the issues with mapping reliability and expense in areas I walk.

[photohiker]

Okay you're splitting hairs now. We could turn this into a detailed technical discussion but I don't see the point. Maybe in another thread if people wanna go down that path? I am aware of the capabilities and limitations of this device. I've outlined how I go about using the SPOT Satellite GPS Messenger above. If you see somewhere I can improve on that please let me know.

This is hardly splitting hair. SPOT does not use the constellation of GPS satellites but its own set of commercial communication satellites with restricted global coverage. It has nothing to do with how you use the device, bread crumbs or not. When you are out of SPOT's satellite coverage area, you are out and there's no crumb. GPS has true global coverage with its 24 satellite constellation while COSPAS-SARSAT (used by PLBs) comes very close if not full coverage. So, the statement "if you can get a GPS signal for mapping you can get a message out on the Spot Satellite GPS messenger" is undeniably false.

Just to clarify, PLB's and Spot do not share the same communication Satellites. So communications reliability will be different depending on location and terrain.

[Nuts]

By the way, if you can get a GPS signal for mapping you can get a message out on the Spot Satellite GPS messenger...

You know this is a false statement, right? I hope you and all others do too. It's very important to understand the range and limitations of their safety equipments.

Pretty hard to argue that better coverage is not all that matters with a beacon.. I happen to think tracking is valuable, especially for the increasing number of solo walkers. I also don't see a lot of "real-world" cases of people being let down by spot?

Sat phones are cheap to buy/ used, not a bad option on a $10 plan.

There's no 'guarantee' of safety, in practice the rift between having 'something', and nothing is far bigger than 'between' gadgets.
I can imagine gadgets 'do' influence some planning decisions, perhaps even in subtle ways.

[phsculpture]

Not having a PLB has definitely determined planning decisions for me. On a recent remote hike (always solo) I was deciding whether or not to descend some steep and loose terrain. Remember standing there thinking if something happens, I take a tumble, sprain or break something, I'm toast. So I turned back. I'm quite conservative, and not reckless, but not having the PLB was the difference whether I went ahead or not.

But the tipping point came when explaining PLBs to my 8yo daughter. She looked me in the eye and told me I had to get one. I'd been a bit blase up to then, but I went and bought one that afternoon. I guess that's the indirect reason. It's as much for loved one's peace of mind, as much as for our safety.

[GPSGuided]

Pretty hard to argue that better coverage is not all that matters with a beacon...

Here's not the place to extend the discussion on PLB and SPOT. My earlier point was simply to point out a faulty statement ie. "if you can get a GPS signal for mapping you can get a message out on the Spot Satellite GPS messenger".

[GPSGuided]

Remember standing there thinking if something happens, I take a tumble, sprain or break something, I'm toast. So I turned back. I'm quite conservative, and not reckless...

...tipping point came when explaining PLBs to my 8yo daughter. She looked me in the eye and told me I had to get one... It's as much for loved one's peace of mind, as much as for our safety.

How that resonates with my situation! It's funny how conservative (that's obviously relative too) and calculating I've become since having a family in tow. Just can't afford to break a bone, let alone more serious scenarios.

[Son of a Beach]

We don't have near as good mobile phone coverage in WA to use a phone as a backup. Pretty much as soon as you're out of city limits that's it until the next city or town, which are further apart in general. I have occasionally loaded offline maps on the iphone as a backup map (might as well since I'll have my phone anyway), but not for getting a fix on location. Would definitely use it that way if I could.

Not sure what you mean here. You don't need cell phone coverage to use the GPS functionality on your phone. Most phones will use cell phone coverage (if its available) in order to get a quicker fix that using satellites alone, but without the cell phone coverage, they'll still use the GPS satellites and get a fix. It just takes a little longer (sometimes up to a minute). The GPS satellite coverage is (theoritically) global.

Or perhaps I've misunderstood what you were saying (in which case, sorry).

[GPSGuided]

Not sure what you mean here. You don't need cell phone coverage to use the GPS functionality on your phone. Most phones will use cell phone coverage (if its available) in order to get a quicker fix that using satellites alone, but without the cell phone coverage, they'll still use the GPS satellites and get a fix. It just takes a little longer (sometimes up to a minute). The GPS satellite coverage is (theoritically) global.

Good clarification as I couldn't quite work out the earlier reasoning either. Further, newer smartphones (chips) can access both GPS and GLONASS services in and out of their mobile service area. Pretty impressive.

[photohiker]

Not having a PLB has definitely determined planning decisions for me. On a recent remote hike (always solo) I was deciding whether or not to descend some steep and loose terrain. Remember standing there thinking if something happens, I take a tumble, sprain or break something, I'm toast. So I turned back. I'm quite conservative, and not reckless, but not having the PLB was the difference whether I went ahead or not.

I think my own assessment of risk in situations like this is not changed at all by the addition of PLB. I need to be responsible for my own safety, and heading down a risky slope because if I have a fall I can just push the button is a pretty serious cop-out. The PLB (or in my case, InReach), is there for unplanned events such as accidents on the trail or medical emergencies, not as some kind of hubris booster.

Now that you have a PLB, you may find that when you approach situations such as the one described, you still don't take the risk. What you thought would be a risk liberation device actually doesn't change the risk at all before the event. Fall down a rocky slope and it only takes one decent knock on your head...

[GPSGuided]

Not as hubris booster. But for me, the availability of a PLB (and GPS) makes me more confident of venturing into less established locations, using my existing gears. Not necessarily more risk of injuries but areas where one would more likely to get lost by traditional means. With GPS and PLB, I am more confident of my location and exit options, potentially willing to carry lesser backup. As such, it has an effect on my end.

[McWade]

Okay you're splitting hairs now. We could turn this into a detailed technical discussion but I don't see the point. Maybe in another thread if people wanna go down that path? I am aware of the capabilities and limitations of this device. I've outlined how I go about using the SPOT Satellite GPS Messenger above. If you see somewhere I can improve on that please let me know.

This is hardly splitting hair. SPOT does not use the constellation of GPS satellites but its own set of commercial communication satellites with restricted global coverage. It has nothing to do with how you use the device, bread crumbs or not. When you are out of SPOT's satellite coverage area, you are out and there's no crumb. GPS has true global coverage with its 24 satellite constellation while COSPAS-SARSAT (used by PLBs) comes very close if not full coverage. So, the statement "if you can get a GPS signal for mapping you can get a message out on the Spot Satellite GPS messenger" is undeniably false.

Yes, you're right GPSGuided. The statement is wrong and I should not have written it as I knew better. I'll not continue with the SPOT Satellite GPS Messenger (as we should be referring to it - SPOT make several devices with different capabilities) discussion except to say that current coverage for Australia is "99% OR BETTER PROBABILIITY OF SUCCESSFULLY SENDING A SINGLE MESSAGE WITHIN 20 MINUTES" and used properly I think it is very useful. Certainly much safer that not having one.

My own evaluation of situation risk and any subsequent decision about action has not changed since carrying a SPOT Messenger. The potential for harm remains the same and having the option to call for rescue (thus risking other people) is not a sound reason, for me, to do anything differently. It does make my wife more comfortable about me going out especially since having our first child. I do go about things differently when solo as opposed to with a group, but that is only because the group activities have different objectives to begin with, like climbing or kayaking where the risks are inherently greater.

[McWade]

Not sure what you mean here. You don't need cell phone coverage to use the GPS functionality on your phone. Most phones will use cell phone coverage (if its available) in order to get a quicker fix that using satellites alone, but without the cell phone coverage, they'll still use the GPS satellites and get a fix. It just takes a little longer (sometimes up to a minute). The GPS satellite coverage is (theoritically) global.

Good clarification as I couldn't quite work out the earlier reasoning either. Further, newer smartphones (chips) can access both GPS and GLONASS services in and out of their mobile service area. Pretty impressive.

Thanks for this. It seems I've been neglecting this capability by using only offline maps as backup maps (and not needed to use them at all yet). I'll investigate. Are there any particular apps you'd recommend?

Not as hubris booster. But for me, the availability of a PLB (and GPS) makes me more confident of venturing into less established locations, using my existing gears. Not necessarily more risk of injuries but areas where one would more likely to get lost by traditional means. With GPS and PLB, I am more confident of my location and exit options, potentially willing to carry lesser backup. As such, it has an effect on my end.

Perhaps the addition of a GPS would make me more willing to venture into areas where one would more likely get lost by traditional means as I have in the past changed my planned route (to follow natural features) due to conditions and only having a map and compass. Maybe I'll get one and find out. I can say with certainty though that it would forever remain a backup to map and compass and not the other way around. As I mentioned earlier, I have come across many walkers, and increasingly so, that see a GPS receiver as a substitute for map and compass instead of a complement and I think this is a dangerous trend. Often they have a paper map but no compass which is better but still not a good idea IMO.

[GPSGuided]

Thanks for this. It seems I've been neglecting this capability by using only offline maps as backup maps (and not needed to use them at all yet). I'll investigate. Are there any particular apps you'd recommend?

I think there's a thread on this somewhere and it also depends on the smartphone platform you are on. For me on iPhone/iOS, I have MotionX-GPS and OpenStreetMaps on mine. MotionX can use off-line maps but there are many others. Here's one such thread.
viewtopic.php?f=21&t=14070&hilit=iPhone+app

I can say with certainty though that it would forever remain a backup to map and compass and not the other way around.

Yes, I don't quite understand the thinking of those who bring a map but not a compass. For convenience, GPS is excellent and can be used for easy local routes or those of greater difficulty. But if a paper map is warranted for back up on the more complex and extended routes, it's illogical to not bring a compass. At the end of the day, electronic gears can run out of juice or fail in other ways. But I have to say, with GPS, magnetic declination and other geometric consideration are things of the past. Who cares which way is north, as long as the dot is at the right spot on the map...

[Son of a Beach]

Are there any particular apps you'd recommend?

I always recommend 'Maps n Trax' (if you're using an iPhone or iPad), but I'm biased because I wrote it. You would need to source your own maps to import into it though, which can be tedious if you don't already have georeferenced map files.

Of course using the GPS facilities in your phone will drain its battery pretty quick. Having the GPS hardware running continuously in an iPhone will drain it in about 4 hours flat. Therefore it should only be used briefly and occasionally if you want it to last.

Last edited by Son of a Beach on Tue 15 Oct, 2013 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[McWade]

Who cares which way is north, as long as the dot is at the right spot on the map...

Yep, can't argue with that as long as the walker also has a map and compass and knows how to use it, which I strongly suspect everyone who reads this thread does and does.

Thinking about this topic I've considered what might be the things that have lead me to my preference for traditional navigation. First is that I'm a minimalist by nature and that carries over to outdoor activities. But apart from that I grew up in an area that was fairly easy to get lost in in some locations (around the Pilbara in Western Australia). I spent a lot of time there in the 80s as a boy camping and walking and canoeing with experienced men. It was hot and dry and cold often cold at night with few water sources, lots of snakes and other bitey creatures etc.. The men I did this with would turn every journey into a lesson. They'd often test me with things like "we can see the stars clearly, tell me which way South is"; "now we have a view of some features we can do a resection, but before we do, how far do you think we have traveled?"; "we have a clear view from here, from what you can see, where do you think you'd most likely find water?"; "there are no big features, how do we get from here to there without getting lost"; "why do we step onto the log first?" and so on..

This was of course a time before GPS. But for me, learning these kinds of things is not a hindrance or negative aspect of walking but actually something that enhances it, even if it is not necessary today. It makes me more aware of my surroundings which enhances my experience. GPS can of course augment traditional navigation and even make things a little safer in certain circumstances. PLBs, and even SPOT devices and similar, would have to be the gear that makes everyone safer, but this kind of tech specifically (not GPS) probably shouldn't change preparation, should it?

Thinking about these things also always reminds my of how awesomely skilled Australian aborigines and other indigenous cultures were at getting around in harsh country...

[McWade]

Thanks for the the thread link and app tips GPSGuided, and thanks the the biased recommendation Son of a Beach , I'll check 'em out.

[GPSGuided]

...I grew up in an area that was fairly easy to get lost in in some locations (around the Pilbara in Western Australia). I spent a lot of time there in the 80s as a boy camping and walking and canoeing with experienced men...

You have been most privileged! That's something most city raised boys like me never had.

[GPSGuided]

I always recommend 'Maps n Trax' (if you're using an iPhone or iPad), but I'm biased because I wrote it.

Is that right? I'll have to look into your product!

[Son of a Beach]

I always recommend 'Maps n Trax' (if you're using an iPhone or iPad), but I'm biased because I wrote it.

Is that right? I'll have to look into your product!

More info on the next major version (hopefully this summer some time) is available at, viewtopic.php?f=27&t=14120

[GPSGuided]

Good on you and look forward to it.

[madmacca]

We don't have near as good mobile phone coverage in WA to use a phone as a backup. Pretty much as soon as you're out of city limits that's it until the next city or town, which are further apart in general. I have occasionally loaded offline maps on the iphone as a backup map (might as well since I'll have my phone anyway), but not for getting a fix on location. Would definitely use it that way if I could.

I assume I won't have mobile coverage while walking too. But the GPS functionality will still work even if you don't have mobile coverage or preloaded maps. It will still give you lat and long, and I use the HandyGPS app to turn this into a 6 figure grid reference to use with a paper map.

[Miyata610]

We don't have near as good mobile phone coverage in WA to use a phone as a backup. Pretty much as soon as you're out of city limits that's it until the next city or town, which are further apart in general. I have occasionally loaded offline maps on the iphone as a backup map (might as well since I'll have my phone anyway), but not for getting a fix on location. Would definitely use it that way if I could.

You don't need phone signal to use the gps in your phone.

[McWade]

It will still give you lat and long, and I use the HandyGPS app to turn this into a 6 figure grid reference to use with a paper map.

Thanks madmacca, this seems like a good use of the phone's GPS capability without having to load maps. I can see myself using this regularly. Will give it a shot.

[GPSGuided]

There are also basic freebie apps that reads out UTM coordinates eg. UTM Position Mailer <https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/utm-position-mailer/id508006003?mt=8>. Do a search in the app store and they are all there.