So many things we did wrong

[Gemma]

I've been lurking for a few weeks learning about places to walk and gear to buy for my new interest...bushwalking.

My sister and I have been walking about 12km on Saturday's for the last 4 weeks. Today we decided to be adventurous and walk a longer distance. I mapped out a walk and estimated the distance which was 20km. We set off at 6:40am this morning and ended up walking for 7 hrs (with rest stops) covering 23.46km. The terrain was very steep and it was a a hard slog especially with the weather heating up during the day.

At the 16km mark I developed pain behind my right knee which I think was a heat cramp. I had bought a pair of Vasque hiking boots the day before and decided to try them out today. I've never worn boots before so that wasn't the smartest thing to do. Any incline triggered the pain and now I can't stand up or walk properly. I had a Gatorade and might get some Magnesium tomorrow. At about 19km I ran out of water. I had a 1.5lt Camelback and and an additional 600ml of water, it was a long walk back in the heat. We made it back to the car and were exhausted and thirsty and I had a thumping headache and felt terrible. Lots of water, a cold bath and lying in front of the air con helped but it took 4 hrs to start feeling better. Apart from the cramp in my leg and a sore knee I am finally feeling like I'm recovering.

We now realise it could have been much worse. I've read alot about being prepared and even did small hikes throughout the USA last year being far more prepared than I was today. I always carried salty food - today I had a Protein Bar. I carry a first aid kit, whistle, compass and a few other things in my pack so I am a little prepared but need to do some more reading. Things turned for the worse very quick on our walk today so hopefuly lessons learned for next time.

I look forward to chatting with you all.

[Nuts]

Tough lessons that you seem to have learnt. Welcome to the forum

[taswegian]

Diamonds are formed by extremes of heat and pressure.
Sounds like you probably crafted some on that walk.

Stick at it and enjoy.

[andrewbish]

Hi Gemma

Look at that - your first decent bush walk and you've already got a great story for the pub/bbq/blog!

Where did you do this walk? Was it worth the pain & effort?

Andrew

[Mark F]

I really hope you continue walking so lets look at the lessons learnt.
Did you check the weather forecast to see what conditions you could expect to encounter?
Don't do 20+km in new boots. Boots do need breaking in unless you are remarkably lucky with the fit.
Did you have an opportunity to replenish your water supply during the walk? The amount you had should just about see you through a normal day of walking (as it almost did). Did you have some extra water (and a snack) in the car for when you returned?
20km+ deserves a decent lunch and a snack or two. Don't worry too much about salt content.
Great to see you had the key basics - I assume you had a map but you didn't mention it.

[colinm]

At the 16km mark I developed pain behind my right knee which I think was a heat cramp. I had bought a pair of Vasque hiking boots the day before and decided to try them out today. I've never worn boots before so that wasn't the smartest thing to do. Any incline triggered the pain and now I can't stand up or walk properly.

If it were a cramp, I would not have expected it to be dependent upon slope. Are you sure it wasn't (say) a touch of arthritis? Depends on your age.

Sometimes when you start walking after a long hiatus the muscles around your knees aren't well enough developed to hold the joint surfaces apart far enough, and you can end up with the joint bearing more of the load than is comfortable. Maybe it was the joint causing the pain, or the muscles around the joint spasming as they became overloaded trying to keep the joint happy. In that case, as you develop your walking muscles, you'd expect to feel less of that.

Colin.

[ferozious]

Always bring sh*tloads of water with you. Even for day walks I bring 3L or more.

The potential benefits far outweigh the disadvantages of carrying the extra weight.

You'll become a stronger walker by carrying the extra weight!

Also, always bring water purification tablets (or a gas stove for boiling if overnight) so that refilling is more feasible.

You can survive for many days with an arresting injury, no food and only water.

I learnt the importance of water on a mid-summer walk along Scott's Main Range...

[Hallu]

Yeah less than 3 L on a 7 hour day walk is crazy. On 35° days you need twice that amount. Also never start a long walk with new shoes/boots. Those are 2 common mistakes, easily avoidable.

[Gemma]

Thanks for the welcome and great advice.

I think the biggest mistake we made was to underestimate the time it would take us to get around our planned route. We had a map (print out from Park website) and I used my phone with the map and GPS tracker so we knew where we were at all times. We are usually finished our walk before the heat hits but this one took much longer than expected. I should have checked the topography so we would know how steep the tracks were because we were slow at ascending. But, I didnt' think to take the proper map - won't do that again.

There was a water supply towards the end and the purification tablets is something on my list to buy. I'll get a 3lt bladder for next time. Any suggestions on where to get a genuine Camelback at a good price? I don't mind the weight of water as I need to get used to carrying weight. I'm planning on some ovenight then multi-day hikes later this year. Yes, definately need to break in the boots. Ankles are slightly sore on touch today. I forgot to mention the pain during the walk on the balls of my feet. I had the same problem with my Asic runners and now the hiking boots. I bought hiking socks but they are not very thick. Should I buy some thicker socks to help with this pain or is it part of breaking in the boots? Any recommendations for socks? Please don't say I've bought the wrong boots! My leg is still very sore but I'm walking better today. It's either ligaments or the top of my calf muscle tightening so I'll see how it goes. I wasn't really clear - it's not actually the knee and I don't have arthritis. I'm 41 and slightly overweight so that may have something to do with it.

We are planning to summit Mt Bogong after this coming season when the snow clears. So I'll keep walking on weekends as well as gym during the week and walks at night (our drive is 1km and we live on a steep hill in the bush) so it's great training too. I'm going to buy a PLB because we walk on our own and don't see anyone else. Yesterday I wouldn't have used the PLB but for us it will be good to have especially as we increase the distance of the walks.

Thanks again for all your advice!

[wayno]

well you came through none the worse for wear in the long run which is the most important thing, and you have identified areas of improvement in your preparation and how you should go about your walk, and thats a great thing..
making mistakes isnt a bad thing if you are willing to identify what the mistakes were and where you can improve on them

also drink before you set out. you will usually be dehydrated when you wake up.... have plenty to drink just before you start on a hot day,,, if you have a fatty and or high protein breakfast that will require a lot of water to digest..
i drink a good half a litre of water before a long day walk,, and that can be o tp of a good half a litre i can drink when i wake up
on a really hot day before a long hard walk i can drink up to a litre before i go.... but i'm not saying you should drink that much
just be midful youre not startng out dehydrated.
water consumption reqirements can vary massively according to the weather, practice will give you an ide of how much wter, you've already gained some ideas on that...
so in colder weather you shouldnt be drinking as much as you are in hot weather.
consumpton could vary from a cup of water when walking to over a litre of water depending on the weather.

[Hallu]

Well either you bought the wrong pair of shoes yes, either your morphology dictates you need more shock absorption. Socks aren't gonna do much, so if it does it every time, either buy some special insoles or go to a podiatrist and have him make you some orthotics.

[Strider]

I would experiment with how you are lacing your boots (there are several methods - Google it). And perhaps also try some aftermarket insoles. I use Superfeet Green and found they made a world of difference to my comfort underfoot.

There is a possibility your boots just won't work for you, but unless it was a rushed purchase from someone not experience at fitting boots I wouldn't expect them to be the problem up front. Lacing is usually the culprit, particularly if you are tightening up over areas which you shouldn't be.

[Allchin09]

Gemma,

Good to hear you're getting out there, hopefully this will be the start of many more walks to come!

Just with regards to the camelbak, be careful! I personally enjoy the convenience of not having to dig through my pack to get some refreshing water, but I have found that I generally consume too much water if I use one. It can be very deceptive how much you drink when the water is so easy to access. I'd suggest sticking to bottles for carrying water instead. That way you are less tempted to over drink and you can manage your water level as it is easy to see how much you have consumed.

As for socks, wool is generally preferred over synthetic in order to help your feet breath. Merino wool is even better.

Hiking boots are much loved by many people, but depending on what sort of walk you are undertaking and your own personal preference, sometimes just wearing joggers that you are used to wearing can be better then big boots. Again, that is something that you will just have to try and see if you prefer it.

Good luck!

[wayno]

research on people using water bladders versus bottles shows that the bottle drinkers waste more water, they drink infrequently, and drink larger amounts when they do and they are more likely to pass the water through their bodies
in general, people using bladders sip water, and their bodies dont pass as much excess water through.
with time it may be that you become more efficient at drinking water with a bladder

[Chris]

Gemma,
As you are fairly new to this forum thought it worth mentioning that drinking too much water can also have disastrous consequences, though much more rarely. Lots of interesting info in this link.
http://bushwalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10965&p=145608&hilit=Bushwalker+dies#p145608

The urine colour check for hydration is generally very useful, but you can be caught out by added colour from some foods and drugs. Currently enjoying my large crop of beetroot is reminding me of that - I got quite worried for a while last year after my first big crop Fortunately googled before making a medical appointment.
Don't know how authoritative this link is but it may be useful.
http://caloriecount.about.com/foods-other-asparagus-change-color-urine-q21999

Congratulations on your first attempt, and on having the courage to post an account of your mistakes - all great learning opportunities

[Hallu]

Yeah I have to try those SuperGreen as well, they may be useful for 7+ hour day walks.

[Strider]

Yeah I have to try those SuperGreen as well, they may be useful for 7+ hour day walks.

They are useful from the moment I put my boots on. Transformed a pair of ok boots to an awesome pair of boots!

[Hallu]

I just ordered the Orange on CampSaver, they didn't have the Green in my size. I'll tell you if this made a difference. I usually can't believe how thin and flimsy default insoles in shoes/boots are, even in serious brands like Zamberlan, Patagonia or Keen. They spend months designing soles and heels and lacing etc... but the insoles are always rubbish.

[Strider]

Zamberlan insoles are a joke!

The orange and green superfeet are fairly similar from memory, with the orange having added forefoot cushioning.

[wayno]

ive yet to find any insoles that come with outdoor footwear to be much good, .
most just collapse and compress to nothing after a while. providing no support.
i always put an aftermarket insole in my footwear.
superfeet for the more flexible footwear but for the footwear that is harder in the midsole i go for sofsol all sport insoles but it put them in the shoes when i go to buy them to make sure they fit together....

[Hallu]

Yeah looks like it's the same as the earphones that come with your mp3 player... They're utterly awful (especially the ones that come with the iphone/ipod and yet so many people still wear them proudly...) and you need to buy quality pairs that end up costing more than the player. In this case luckily insoles are less expensive than the shoes, but 50 $ is still quite steep.

[puredingo]

Gemma, I've been fat, skinny, fit and outa shape. I've had shoes that cost $500 and shoes that cost $50, spent a fortune on podiartry and all the while my feet have always been a problem (consequently knees too). Be sure to exhaust all options because it is a curse to live with bad feet but sometimes, if your unlucky, that will be just a cross you have to bear. You'll get used to it and especially on the better walks the accomplishment of the walk outweighs the innconveince of the sore, tired feet.
As for the camelback personally i don't go for them. I can definitely see the merit in them but usually for me if it's time for a drink them it's about time for a breather too, my waters always on top so it's no biggy to sit and enjoy the view awhile.

[Gemma]

I bought some Superfeet Blue insoles with the boots (based on reading on here for insoles...thanks). I hadn't actually researched which insoles so went with what was recommended. Looks like I should have bought the Orange or Green for extra cushioning. I'm sure they helped though. I get the same soreness from my runners as the boots so it could be my feet. I researched boots for days and tried on about 12 pairs..Mammut, Asolo, La Sportiva, Salomon, Vasque, Zamberlan & Scarpa. I was going back to buy the La Sportiva leather Typhoon GTX boots that I'd tried on 3 days earlier but they felt wrong the second time. I had on the same hiking socks both times so not sure why the difference??

I've used a Camelback when mountain biking many years ago and it's convenient having the water always there. Having too much is not something I've thought about but will look into it. I always have water with me 24/7 and I'm always drinking so might need to look at how much I am drinking on a normal day and how much I should be drinking on the hike. I take vitamins which make a difference to the colour of urine, didn't know food did too.

Leg injury is slowly getting better which I'm happy about. Still can't go to gym or walk properly and hopefully it will be better soon. Looking at trekking poles at the moment as I think they may help too and will consider a podiatrist to check my feet. Will also look at lacing the boots, guy at the shop (Bogong in Little Bourke Melbourne) told me how to lace them but I'll look it up too. Thanks again for your advice, I'm learning a lot everytime I come on here

[Snowzone]

Hi Gemma,

There is a big difference walking 12km and doubling it to nearly 24km. No wonder you have sore spots. I would hope its just muscle soreness but maybe you need to get it checked if the pain continues.
Don't stress too much over your boots. Good solid walking boots take a lot of breaking in and you need to do it over time. Shorter walks on different type of terrain and hopefully before you know it they will be like your best buddies.

I'm not sure where you walked but the kind of heat we've had in Victoria recently is pretty tough to walk in. I double my water in these kind of conditions and even then I still need to rehydrate after a walk. It sounds like you've learned your lessons and by the way we all keep learning them. So I hope you continue and enjoy.

Vicki

[wayno]

wearing heavier footwear for the first time on a walk can affect muscles right up to your lower back having to swing the extra weight on your legs. just pulling the extra weight off the ground repeatedly could account for any soreness... in the lower half of the body

[climberman]

Hi Gemma,

Glad to hear you are pretty much OK !

The knee pain, related to incline, may be Ilio-Tibial Band issues (ITB). Look it up and go see a physio who knows sport type things. I get ITB issues occasionally, particularly with extensive downhill walking. Difficult muscle group to stretch, but not impossible.

[tom_brennan]

If you're worried about your knee, go and see a (sports) physio, particularly if you're still unable to walk properly. Knees are usually not too hard to diagnose compared to other parts of the body.

[davidmorr]

There was a water supply towards the end and the purification tablets is something on my list to buy. I'll get a 3lt bladder for next time.

It may be more useful to keep your existing bladder and take a 1.5 litre bottle as well. When needed, you can pour the water from the bottle into the bladder.

I had an incident once where my one-and-only water bottle broke, and I was left with no way to carry water for the rest of the walk, an overnight backpack. So now I always carry at least two containers for water.

[perfectlydark]

Well I think rather than a new thread this one will do.
I was reminicing during lunch probably the stupidest trip I made. It was when I was new to it all, on my second overnight. The weather forecast for the next day was heavy rain. Despite this, the first day was clear, warm, cloudless..a perfect day really. As such I didnt bother setting my tarp up over my tent.
Oh I should mention, the tarp I brought was a green heavy duty thing from bunnings.
So of course the rains came overnight, and being tired, lazy and wet all I did was toss the tarp over my tent. Didnt string it up or anything.
Needless to say it was a wet sleepless night amd I learnt many valuable lessons! Ive not used that tent since (it was a kmart tent lol) and obviously wouldnt consider a big green work tarp for rain cover (nor would I just toss it over lol)
Best way to learn is to fail epically sometimes

[MartyGwynne]

Yes the best way to learn sometimes is to fail quite well, but live to tell the tale.
My big thing I did wrong was once I was leading a four day walk straight after nightshift, no sleep. I got a snooze in the car on the way up though.
I forgot to get some metho for the trangia, not good I had filled the burner though (I was sharing cooking with one other).
I forgot to change into my walking attire - not big cotton boxers with cotton shorts. It rained heavily the whole four days, needles to say the chafing was rather bad.
I now have a standard pack list where I tick off all the items I really need to wear and pack.
I lived and learnt.