How much is too much?

[Mechanic-AL]

I have a little Coleman Exponent tent. Last week I decided to upgrade and purchased a Hilleberg Nallo 2. I,m heading down the Overland Track in May and decided that I needed something more 'reliable'. I haven't done any multi day trips with the new Nallo yet but it,s certainly passed the test on a few overnighters close to home. After one such trip I decided to put the new tent up in the backyard and park the old one along side it and do a bit of a comparison. I got to thinking about just how many times the old tent had let me down. And the answer I came up with was none. I,ve estimated it has done around 45 nights in the Tasmanian bush ( would have been a lot more if I hadn't of been foolish enough to move to W.A.) including a few tent bound days at Cracroft Crossing and Louisa River...... And never let me down.
So as I sat comparing the two tents in the backyard I began to wonder just what is was that made me shell out the best part of a weeks wages to get a new tent? The little Coleman was sold as a 2 man tent and there is no doubt that if you weren't fairly intimate with who ever you were sharing it with you probably would be by the morning! The 2 man Hilleberg was palatial by comparison. But that's about as far as I got. There is no doubt that there is value for money with either one of these products but if I'm going to be honest I guess I got the new tent partly because the old on just didn't give off the signals of a 'hardcore bushwalker'. As a keen surfer I am always amused when I see people at the beach equipped with all the state of the art go fast gear and then when they hit the water they are flat out just getting to their feet. No doubt all that expensive equipment makes them feel better though.
I,m sure when I put up my new tent for the first time in May I'm going to feel a bit fake. Bit of a wanker maybe. I know I already feel a bit guilty that I will be leaving a perfectly good tent behind ( Yeah... I know it's just a tent but you do get kind of attached to these sort of things !).

I know just from reading a lot of posts on this forum that most people have comfort and safety as their priority when they are purchasing new gear but I am left to wonder just how much image and marketing play a part in the bushwalking community?

Semi- guilty as charged.

AL

[icefest]

I'm probably guilty.

I try to avoid hiking-glam when I'm not out bushwalking.

I try to stick with 'form follows function', but don't always succeed.

[andrewa]

The extension of this is just to sleep under a tarp...

Yep, I've got a Hilleberg Nallo 3 GT - used to take It to NZ for wilderness fishing trips, but, after many trips, we now realise that we pnly really need a tarp, and bug protection, so now sleep on upturned packrafts with a bug net, under a big enough tarp.

Hilleberg has now been relegated to ski touring, or hiking when it might rain a lot, or where it might be very windy. Also perfect for weekend's skiing on Bogong, where a tarp/z packs hexamid, just wouldn't "deal with it".

I also have a 10lbs plus 3 person 5 pole geodesic dome, which is preferred tent for longer ski touring trips, or trips when you know the weather is going to turn foul, or when you have 2 adults and a child.


There probably isn't a perfect tent. It depends on where you are going, and what the weather forecast is. The Hilleberg Nallo GT is the "better" tent I've bought to date, but overkill for some situations, and underkill for others.

A

[Hallu]

It's just perfectionism. We all want the best, and nowadays it's very easy to know what the best is, with reviews and opinions on forums such as this one. It's not falling into a marketing scheme, it's just that we like what's new and better. Our old cars worked fine as well, but nowadays they'd be considered rubbish. What has mostly evolved for cars ? The same as for tents : safety and comfort (although it went the other way around regarding lightness).

[DarrenM]

Any thoughts of being a wanker will disappear when the first storm gives you a flogging and the gear does it's job. I like new gear because it usually replaces something that has failed from overuse.....I often wonder whether some folk actually go hiking to see new places, or geek out on kit.

[cajun]

While I am very new to bushwalking, my other favourite pasttime is fishing (which I am very old at ). When I bought our set up gear a few weeks ago (packs / shoes etc) I was struck by the parallel between the two pasttimes. They are both "accessory" sports, and I am guilty of geekdom in both I would suspect. Rob Sitch and Tom Gleisner had a theory in the "A River Somewhere" series, that people are attracted to such sports.

I know people who fish for bream with rods and reels that cost more than a grand. I saw an eating utensil for ultralight walking the other day for $30 odd dollars. Neither make sense to me, but if you can afford it, and it makes you happy - no harm no foul I reckon.

[Scottyk]

Marketing plays a massive part in bushwalking gear, anyone who says otherwise is kidding themselves.

[Mechanic-AL]

I'm not suggesting there is anything wrong with having the best gear you can afford but does it make anybody less proficient at what they are doing because they don't have top of the wozza gear? I guess this line of thinking came about when I put the old tent up in the backyard and realised that I have a stronger attachment to it than I thought. No doubt the new tent will achieve the same status over time. Hope so.

AL

[walkon]

Hey Al

I so laughed out loud when I read this as we have not long had this very conversation. It was decided that Hardcore is the person out there in well used gear still living the dream and just getting the job done. Though we were all hypocritical to some degree.

Even though my old tent was too short for me, I'm 6'4", it was still serviceable and I have felt guilty about updating it. The fact that the old tent was about 20% the cost of the new one is not lost on me. After one night in the new sleeping bag there was no such remorse, the sleeping mat was the same. Have drawn the line at the pack, still very serviceable and comfy.

Now how can scruff up the new gear without stuffing it up....

[Mechanic-AL]

I try to stick with 'form follows function', but don't always succeed.[/quote]


I wonder when it was that style and marketing became a part of bushwalking. I would imagine that bushwalkers in the 40's and 50' s would have put function as their one and only priority.
It just seems that while we are all running around spouting off different theories on how to save the planet it is still O.K. to ditch perfectly good gear to keep up with the latest technology and styles.

I can't remember the name of the place but I recall seeing a shop in Hobart recently that sold used bushwalking gear. I hope they are still around because it is a great idea.
There is probably tonnes of perfectly good equipment gathering dust in peoples sheds around the place.

Now do I keep the old tent to or pass it on ...........?

[Nuts]

Keep it! -sell the new one?
Seriously, if your a surfer your never gonna look anywhere near as cool bushwalking anyway!

nallo are a great tent, much along the lines of 'bombproof' like macpacs old Olympus.
About the only downside is the weight, and the suckers do get heavy with all that fabric when they are damp through.
With a bit of care you can get away much lighter and cheaper, the k-mart a A frame we had on our first trip survived. It actually looked cool enough
went with the stubbies and bush/wool shirt look

[Nuts]

Actually, maybe you want to swap your Nallo for one that 'looks the part' do you ??

[Gadgetgeek]

a buddy of mine often wonders the same thing. He has been unfortunate enough to have had to replace all of his gear twice, (one housefire, one trip to NZ that ended with all his kit being stolen) We both own far more gear than we "need" but don't really have a reason to do with less. We both try to put function first, which means heaps of trying things out in store, and research. But at the end of the day, if it gets you out there, do whatever you want. I guess too much would be gear that's "too nice" to go get used.

[Strider]

I can't remember the name of the place but I recall seeing a shop in Hobart recently that sold used bushwalking gear.

Recycled Recreation is a pop-up shop that appears from time-to-time. To be honest, I would prefer to buy direct from a forum member than pay any markup that might be added.

[Jag]

Innovation & style , material technolgy & design never go away . I once had all the newest gear & now still enjoy looking at other's decisions about what they brought & why . Sometimes I get jealous . I have now also been on the receiving end of 'ooohh mine weighs only 4 grams & packs to 2ccm.

I met someone who had 14 tents . For some aquiring new gear is a hobby & source of great joy . I sneak in a few things I really don't need here & there because Iike it . We only live once . Enjoy it.

Why are bushwalkers such curmudgeons?

[Empty]

I feel your pain Al. I too just forked out a ridiculous sum for a Hilleberg Akto. Never even heard of Hilleberg before I joined this forum so I am putting it down to peer pressure.

Hopefully the extra money, extra weight and extra prestige will be worth it someday.

[Jag]

i have never heard of Hilleberg but went over to have a look. Does it come with a year supply of elderberry wine or something?

[Brissy GH]

I do agree with the "we only live once" attitude but it is easy to get sucked into the technicality and hype of new gear. Promises of lighter, tougher, stronger, smarter are difficult to ignore. I have definitely bought stuff I didn't need.

Actually my tent is the only thing that has stood the test of time. The classic mid 80's Fairydown Sting is still in perfect nick and can handle any conditions. It probably doesn't tick the "lighter" box any more but it will do me.

Last edited by Brissy GH on Mon 31 Mar, 2014 3:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[DaveNoble]

Actually my tent is the only thing that has stood the test of time. The classic mid 80's Macpac Sting is still in perfect nick and can handle any conditions. It probably doesn't tick the "lighter" box any more but it will do me.

Hey! The "Sting" was not made by Macpac. It was made by Fairydown. It was a good tent in its day. I used one for many years in lots of nasty conditions.

Dave

[Brissy GH]

Hey that's funny... you are absolutely correct.
And it is not like I should forget given that the name is splashed across each side of the tent!! Previous post edited.

[slparker]

I feel your pain Al. I too just forked out a ridiculous sum for a Hilleberg Akto. Never even heard of Hilleberg before I joined this forum so I am putting it down to peer pressure.

Hopefully the extra money, extra weight and extra prestige will be worth it someday.

Damn... same here. It replaced a macpac minaret that was buggered; but the akto, whilst slightly lighter, is more claustrophobic; slightly more difficult to erect,is a hideous yellow colour inside and seems to collect more condensation (despite having a vent at each end). I haven't used it for snow yet but have also read that it is not particularly good in a heavy dump.

In saying that, I really appreciated the whole 200g weight saving on my SCT walk in january

[Empty]

I feel your pain Al. I too just forked out a ridiculous sum for a Hilleberg Akto. Never even heard of Hilleberg before I joined this forum so I am putting it down to peer pressure.

Hopefully the extra money, extra weight and extra prestige will be worth it someday.

Damn... same here. It replaced a macpac minaret that was buggered; but the akto, whilst slightly lighter, is more claustrophobic; slightly more difficult to erect,is a hideous yellow colour inside and seems to collect more condensation (despite having a vent at each end). I haven't used it for snow yet but have also read that it is not particularly good in a heavy dump.

In saying that, I really appreciated the whole 200g weight saving on my SCT walk in january

That is an interesting insight. I have not used mine yet so i can't comment on the condensation but am disappointed to hear it is not better than what you describe.

I did not need the akto just wanted it and had a blonde moment when ordering as I thought the order was expressed in Aussie dollars. Got stung badly!

My other tent is a moment single wall so I am steeping up in weight quite a bit (which is probably why I haven't used it yet). Think I'll wait for a cyclone warning and step out then to justify buying it. Quality is superb though and I quite like the yellow. Reminds me of my old salewa leone.

[slparker]

It's a good tent, Empty. Just having a whinge. I got it on sale from the US at a very good price. It is an easy to erect tent and has a lot of good features; good vestibule space, strong and light (supposedly bombproof in alpine terrain too) i'm just not convinced that's it''s worth the money.
The condensation was a surprise but it was humid and raining pretty constantly for the first few days of the walk. The first time the foot of my sleeping bag has ever been soaked, though. I'm sure my bag wasn't touching the inner too. I've never had this issue with my old macpac except when my bag has touched the inner and fly.
Surprisingly I got claustrophobic in it, that's never happened to me before... it really is a one man shelter.

[Empty]

I appreciate your words of encouragement as I was already suffering buyers remorse and your post tipped me ever so closer to depression. I was intending to buy a scarp and then decided on the new hubba nx but swerved at the last minute and bought the hilleberg and I am still not quite sure why.

Most of the reviews I read we're pretty favourable but a couple really gave it a caning. The negative ones seem to be by blokes that had higher expectations of the tent than what was probably intended by the manufacturer.

I have previously only owned two man twin vestibule/entry tents and never had a prob with condensation maybe because of the cross flow ventilation. I used my TT moment on the weekend which has arguably more ventilation than the hilleberg and copped quite a bit of condensation so I am guessing it is a feature of small single door tents.

I think the atko is probably more tent than I need for my type of walking but I am stuck with it now. I also splashed out for a new neo air mattress and used it for the first time on Saturday night. Did not like it at all so guess I have done my dough there as well.

So on the topic of "how much is enough" I would make an interesting case study.

[slparker]

Apparently they have been used successfully in Antarctica so any criticism should be weighed up with a very sound construction and wind resistance. My whinge was just a whinge and, upon reflkection, the tent probably isn't designed specifically for muddy damp temperate conditions so much as cold alpine areas. There's always a compromise - .

If it's any consolation it will probably last 20 years... so it's not wasted money.

[GPSGuided]

Too much is when fellow walkers on a route is wearing K-mart shorts and T-shirt and cheap joggers, completing the course with the same freshness as oneself decked out in "superior" gears.

[puredingo]

His comparison to surfing is spot on. It used to be a sport full of soul now it's a sport full of SOLD. The wanker factor in surfing is off the scale.

Will bushwalking follow?...I doubt it, it's not the sort of activity you can sell to television...or is it?

[walkon]

His comparison to surfing is spot on. It used to be a sport full of soul now it's a sport full of SOLD. The wanker factor in surfing is off the scale.

Will bushwalking follow?...I doubt it, it's not the sort of activity you can sell to television...or is it?

I think hiking is on the way to that 'sold stage'. Though surfing does have alot more roosters struting around trying to look good and its takes alot less effort than bushwalking so there is a chance for us.

[stepbystep]

.....I often wonder whether some folk actually go hiking to see new places, or geek out on kit.

Hmmmm, I don't wonder about this!

I've shifted a bit in my policy. I find kit that works for me and do the best to make it last as long as possible. Boots and gaiters are my biggest problem expense wise. A lot of other gear has lasted a long time. The key is to build up winter/summer kits, use it appropriately and repair if you can. My problem is I'm always too buggered after a walk to clean my boots properly!

But if you only walk a cpl weeks a year your gear should last a lifetime

[DarrenM]

I agree. Buying good gear is a start, and I also repair what I have. I've lost count of how many times I'm sewing up gear the night before a trip. I'm trying to go lighter these days but going lighter means leaving tents and cooking equipment at home. I need a fairly heavy duty pack for carrying gear through canyons or strapping skis, snowboards etc to so dropping to a lighter pack is difficult.

I guess I am a geek when it comes to gear but only because failing equipment usually means a pretty miserable outcome.