Bushwalk leadership

[mikethepike]

Good leaders has been mentioned in a couple of other threads on bushwalking clubs and I thought it would be interesting to follow this topic up. In fact it's to get a bit of feedback on what people see in a good leader. This is of interest to me because I joined a club a few years ago and am interested in becoming a walks leader. Yes I've read on the subject (topics such as conflict resolution which I've never really experienced on a walk) and even attended a short course but it would be helpful to hear of the leadership attributes that forum members see as the more important. Thanks.

[Macca81]

Be sure of yourself, but dont be arrogant. Be willing to take others advice, even if you dont follow it. Be willing to admit you *&%$#! up when you have.

[corvus]

Know where exactly where you are going having been there before would be a good start
corvus

Last edited by corvus on Thu 12 Apr, 2012 12:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

[michael_p]

As someone who leads walks all I can say is the most important thing is to be yourself.

If you want some other tips here goes:
- Be open about your expectations for the day. I like exploring areas (including off-track exploring) and I advise participants to have an open mind as we could have an interesting walk or it could be a waste of time.
- As Macca81 said, if you stuff up admit to it. So much better that people know that something has gone wrong and needs to dealt with than wandering around thinking that all is well. On one off-track walk the scrub was so bad we made little progress, after a while I told everyone that we were way behind on our goal for the day and we pulled the pin early on the walk (it still took 10hrs to cover 10km).
- Try and learn a bit about the walk. See if there are interesting spots to visit along the way or if there is some interesting history about the area you are walking in.
- Keep an eye on everyone in your party. Even the best walkers can encounter problems. A friend was leading a group and had a very experienced walker take ill down in the Grose Valley, it was a nerve racking experience getting the walker back up out of the valley by foot.
- As suggested by Corvus. This is not always possible but if you can make sure you know the walk prior to heading out with your group.
- A good idea is to start with walks you know and feel comfortable with then branch out after you gain more experience/confidence.
- Don't be afraid to act like a leader. Unfortunately I've had a walk hijacked and I had to put my foot down to get the walk back on track (so to speak ).

Talk to your club about moving up to walk leading. Your club should have some mechanism for getting you started as a walk leader. You will probably need to know the club's policies and procedures anyway so you will have to talk to them at some stage, the earlier the better. Try to get an experienced walk leader to act as a mentor.

I hope the above is in some way useful.

Cheers,
Michael.

[Son of a Beach]

If you're a fast walker, learn to walk slow. It can be demoralising for slower walkers feeling that they're getting left behind, or that they're slowing everybody down. However, don't walk quite as slow as the slowest person. I generally find that the slowest person will often walk a tiny bit faster if they feel that they're almost keeping up. Once they're way behind, they sort of give up trying to keep up and revert to their natural slower pace again.

[pazzar]

If you're a fast walker, learn to walk slow. It can be demoralising for slower walkers feeling that they're getting left behind, or that they're slowing everybody down. However, don't walk quite as slow as the slowest person. I generally find that the slowest person will often walk a tiny bit faster if they feel that they're almost keeping up. Once they're way behind, they sort of give up trying to keep up and revert to their natural slower pace again.

I had to learn this. I tend to walk at the back of the group, but make sure I push the people in front of me. I've also learnt that I need to compensate extra time for a group. The time that I could cover by myself is generally much faster than when in a group, so I need to tack on a bit of extra time when giving the group an estimated walk time.

I don't necessarily think that having done the trip before is essential. For me that is part of the adventure. As long as the group is prepared for any scenario, and I know roughly where I am going, then we are set for adventure. A lot of the walks that I lead are like this - I don't do a lot of return visits, although they are becoming increasingly more frequent at the moment.

[alliecat]

I was going to say more but others have covered it better. I would as one thing though - take a map!!! And be willing to show it to anybody who wants to see it. Yep, I've had a leader with no map, and one who refused to share it...

Cheers,
Alliecat

[zac150]

My two bobs worth, we have two ears, two eyes and one mouth use them proportionately i.e listen and observe before talking.

I lead a lot of walks with guys I work with, they are of varying age, experience and fitness levels. The biggest thing I have found is to listen too and observe participants before and during the walk so that you truly know exactly where each person is at physically and mentally. This helps, as some walkers are mentally strong and will push through where other physically strong walkers fail. I find this really helps in the decision making process as you have all the information when making critical decisions.

With regard to slow walkers etc, I walk with one guy who is the slowest walker in the pack when at the back, but the fastest when walking in the lead? Sometimes it is psychological and understanding each walker helps to place them in the group and make group decisions.

[Lindsay]

After reading this I know why I walk solo.

[mikethepike]

Thanks everybody for all the posts on topic so far. I have found them really helpful.

Know where exactly where you are going having been there before would be a good start

Yes that is a good idea but I also like the idea of covering new ground and that I will cope and that people in the group will believe this.

My two bobs worth, we have two ears, two eyes and one mouth use them proportionately i.e listen and observe before talking.

Yes,well put I think. I will remember that.

After reading this I know why I walk solo.

Actually I thinks that's a part of my problem - I've done so much solo walking you can get a bit slack about communication. No good when you're the leader!

Last edited by mikethepike on Fri 13 Apr, 2012 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[mikethepike]

A 'funny' incident just occurred to me.
A few years ago a new club member and I did a private trip to a fairly remote bushwalking location. Little more than five minutes after we set out, we came came across a patch of thick 3m tall scrub. This prompted the following response from my companion. "Which way now? You're the leader!". This did somewhat startle me. The walk was my idea and it was his first ever bushwalk so in that respect, I suppose I was the leader but I didn't think about it in those terms. Instead I thought (but didn't say) 'hang on a minute, we're both in this together'. Anyway, this suddenly imposed status and new responsibility made me momentarily irrational! Instead of doing the sensible thing and walking around the scrub, I just called out "Yeah no probs. just follow me" (or words to that effect) and we pushed on straight ahead as if it was part of the original plan. It was all bravado on my part of course and luckily the scrub was only 30m thick. What disappointed me was that he couldn't see the funny side of things. I mean, here we were, we'd just spent the last hour driving through low scattered salt-bush country and with scarcely a plant more than shoulder high to be seen and then we go and stumble on the only patch of thick scrub in 2000 sq.km! Forget any leadership qualities of lack thereof, I'd almost call that genius!

Despite any impressions that the above story might give, I am trying seriously to be a good leader and look forward to any further thoughts on leadership that people might have. Thanks!

[Lindsay]

I suppose the only leadership advice I can give is that you can't be all things to all people and some of your decisions will be unpopular. However you must stick with what you believe to be the correct course of action no matter what others think. By all means listen to the opinions of others and adopt them if you think they are worthwhile, and be adaptable to changing circumstances, but always remember than the final decision is yours and avoid the dreaded leadership by comittee scenario.

[Tortoise]

A couple of thoughts:

Whatever rating you give the walk, make sure you stick to that. e.g if you have time, and several of the group are quite fit enough to do an extra few kms, not everyone might be up to it, and they might not speak up even if asked. (It's a different situation if people know it's an exploratory walk.)

Make sure everyone doesn't get up and leave as soon as the slowest person arrives at a stop! It does happen.

[ILUVSWTAS]

Make sure everyone doesn't get up and leave as soon as the slowest person arrives at a stop! It does happen.

Yes thats a very good point.

In college, we were always taught to put the slowest ppl in front, and go at their pace.

[Ent]

Leadership has the almost magically elusive quality of respect. Some people just get it while most have to earn it. Once lost very hard to get back. Trust is the key component.

I admire people at walking clubs that take on the role of leader, or the now legally modified term of coordinator. The biggest hassle they face is "experienced" other walkers in the group. New people are happy to trundle along but the "experts", that incidentally have a history of shirking leadership responsibility, can make the official leader's life hell.

I lost interest in bushwalking club after a few walks were the "experts" decided that they knew better and wandered off splitting the group. The result was a shambles.

One leader amazed me with his ability to keep the group organized. I complemented him on this and he confided that he hated leading groups with some "experienced" individuals. Interesting when he was not leading he was fully supportive of the designated leader. Pity some "experienced" club walkers did not do the same.

Anyway, sense of humor and thick skin is required and the patience of a saint. I congratulate anyone taking on the role.

"Herding cats" is the best description I have heard when leading "mature" adults.

Cheers

[GD4Up]

"Herding cats" is the best description I have heard when leading "mature" adults.

Try 'herding blind cats'

A good leader is someone who people want to follow - it covers the trust, knowledge, rapport-building and all the other elements

[anotherwalker]

As the leader of the group, not only is it important to look after the group such as keeping everyone together and happy.

But its also important to take a map, track notes and compass, and admit when you're not sure.

I was recently hiking with a guy who had done the walk countless times before. I had never done this particular walk before.

At one point he completely lost the track expecting to see it further down the bush.

After 20 minutes of bushbashing, I eventually asked to stop so I could pull out the track notes I had in my back pack just in case. So we could find out where we went wrong.

After finding our way back to the track and losing 40 minutes only to get back to the trail, I was less than confident/impressed with the leader of the group and wouldn't be confident with him to lead another walk in the future.

[robl]

I lead day walks from time to time for a bushwalking group. The walks have usually been planned, graded and checked out. Long walks and exploratory walks I usually go solo.

If you have volunteered to be a leader then you will probably know more about the walk than the others and they will follow you.
Having a map and compass will give them confidence and you authority. If you can keep most of the group onside then any recalcitrant won't grumble to you. (Too long, hard, etc.)
They will certainly grumble to others in the group but you will probably not hear about it till some weeks have passed.

In our group a person can turn up on the day after having found a program and the leader should decide if that person is good enough for the walk.
The person that looks tough and talks tough can be a problem.

I had one a few years ago. She arrived dressed well and in Scarpa Treks and proudly told me she had been walking in Tassie. I am easily impressed and said ok.
The walk was graded as moderate and included some rock hopping.

She fell to rear moving slowly and I didn't see much of her but I knew where she was and how she was going. Some weeks later I heard that she had become alarmed when we left the road and entered light forest and then complained to the others for the entire walk. But not to me. She probably never left a footpath or boardwalk before that day. She didn't walk with us again.

I now make it very clear to new people that our group is a "bushwalking" group. In larger clubs people would "move up through the grades" to gain abilities but this is hard in small clubs. Probably the most difficult thing in a club is reaching a consensus for the grading of walks. This link might help.
http://www.dsr.nsw.gov.au/active/whatson_walk.asp

robl

[Rodsports]

Regarding maps, every walk I have lead I have provided (or at least given the option) a colour map (photocopy) of the walk. We have a brief discussion before setting off (a walk 'induction') that consists of greetings, an overview of the walk, proposed camp sites, location of car keys in case of an emergency, and anything that the group would like to raise at this time. I also ask who is a fast walker and who considers themselves a slow walker. If I know that people in the group are well experienced I also point that out to any newer walkers in the group. I may be the leader but Im not always the wisest person there.

Im in CMW and one idea they have is they have a experienced put up a walk that an inexperienced person volunteers to lead. This new leader is then coached through the process so they can practice 'leading' with the support from the experienced leader. The experienced leader will only step in when asked or if they see something occurring that will not lead to the required outcome or is dangerous. This is a great way to learn the skills and gain confidence in leadership.

[north-north-west]

After reading this I know why I walk solo.

+1

I never minded doing the dive guide thing, even when I was paying for the boat trip, but it's not for that long. An hour at the most, usually.
But having to herd a bunch of people through the bush - even on a track - *shudder* no thanks. Too much like hard work.

[MartyGwynne]

I agree with what has beens said so far and have learnt a thing or two as well.
One thing I find very useful is to make sure you set out the ground work first such as research the walk do a reccie as much as possible.
also gather the group together before hand to ensure every one is briefed in the walk (call them a planning session and involve a drink or two with a feed).
I also print out a copy of the map and track notes and send everyone a copy a week or two before the walk.
Be very firm on the minimum gear you will need i.e. wet weather or snow/alpine gear etc must be carried by each person and must be of a standard to cope with the worst conditions possible (even to the point of packing in an extra spare or two of your own gear to ensure every one is covered if you have any doubts about anyone's gear or understanding of what gear is needed.
Yes I have had to cope with substandard gear on my early walks, and have been very surprised by some who I thought to be OK to have the right gear with them but did not by a long way...
It is not rude to suggest a few of you get together before a walk and practice packing all of the gear into everyones packs - this gives you a chance to sus out their
gear/clothes/tent/coat and if they have packed a pack before.
Fortunately I mainly do long extended walks and don't have the novice walker so often (always rate the walk hard...)
For the slow walker I try to get someone every day or part of the day to walk behind them, as this is the best way to get them walking faster or at the very least stay within talking distance from them.
If it is going to be a hard day's walk make sure you tell every one that it is going to be hard (or even unknown) and the earliest the group gets going the better, but make sure plenty of food and rest stops are taken and every one is drinking water. Yes you are mother duck sometimes and keep an eye out for how everyone is travelling.
It is always very rewarding when at the end of a walk everyone thanks you for leading the walk and getting everyone through the tough parts and how enjoyable the good parts of the walk were.
Marty