Weight of packs - south coast track

[Mafeking09]

Just out of interest I'd love to know what people are carrying as a pack weight. We're about to leave for the South Coast Track on Saturday. Done all shopping and supplies. We're in a group of six but sharing in twos for food, tents etc. Looks like pack will be around 19.5kg and feels a bit lighter than other trips (gas has saved me kgs). I hear of 15KG packs for 7 day walks - they must go seriously light on food?

[frenchy_84]

yeah 17-20kgs is pretty reasonable, with a proper tent and 7 days food. With that kind of pack weight, its definately worth the extra weight of a hard wearing pack with proper harness (ie Oneplanet or Macpac) which then adds over a kilo compared with the lightweight packs on the market.

[Penguin]

Aiming for under 20kg's for a walk like this is both reasonable and "safe". A rugged pack should not stop you staying under 20kg's and the lighter weight does make the walk more enjoyable.

A few years back I did the Southern range and out along the South Coast Track. I started with 23kg and certainly felt the weight on the harder days. The amount of weight you carry obviously depends on your level of fitness, the difficultly of the track, the level of exposure of the track, the state of your knees and what you consider the minimum level of comforts you want to take with you. These are all individual decisions. Also the amount of money you have to spare to spend on gear. There are lots of threads here about reducing weight.

I recently did the Western Arthurs and started with 14.6kg excluding water but including the water bladder. This was 8 days worth of food. During the walk we had all sorts of weather and my gear coped with it all. My knees loved the lighter weight. But another started the walk with around 20kgs as a starting weight and he bounded along - more intact knees and younger.

I hope yo enjoy the planning and get even more fun from the walk.

P

[ColD]

I should know this but what is the ratio of pack to hauler. I'm fifty kilos.

[ILUVSWTAS]

I should know this but what is the ratio of pack to hauler. I'm fifty kilos.

I think they say a qtr of your body weight.

[Penguin]

I should know this but what is the ratio of pack to hauler. I'm fifty kilos.

I think they say a qtr of your body weight.

I wonder if this ratio increases as body weight decreases?

1/4 seems the std that most use apart from the armed services that seems about 100% of body weight!

[nakedape]

7-9 day walks see me starting with about 23kg (I'm 95kg) - we could do with lighter tent & we love our food (gourmet of course). My other half starts these walks with 19-21kg (she is 65kg) & copes surprisingly well - but then she's a dairy farmers daughter (i.e. bones as strong as steel). As stated above - your fitness level and personal preferences will determine your weights.

[Snowzone]

I should know this but what is the ratio of pack to hauler. I'm fifty kilos.

I think they say a qtr of your body weight.

I seem to end up closer to a third of my weight on a week long walk. Basically being a solo walker and not skimping on food or safety there is no way I can get near a quarter.
Ok well I could probably leave the chocolate and port out.... nope that wouldn't work either.

[norts]

I did the SW Cape Circuit earlier this year, both of us were ccompletely self sufficient except for PLB and First Aid Kit
I was carrying 21.5kgs that was with 1.25 litres of water, and it included the PLB and FA Kit.
I did the OT this year as well I started with 26 kg , and long days , my wife does not walk fast. I think that was just too much.
IRoger

[Ent]

Hi

And someone hauled 26 kilograms on that WA trip and still found themselves underdone on water and camp shoes.

Pack weight is a personal thing as is what people want and expect from their gear. Light weight has the advantage it is easier to protect as you need to do less pack hauling. But solid gear is wonderful when things turn nasty or unplanned.

A solid large pack will tip the scales at around three kilogram mark and add say three liters of water and you are six kilograms. Such a pack should be comfortable at any weight your fitness and knees can support.

My goal is around twenty kilograms and as the original poster writes sharing gear is a good way if lighting the load.

I am playing with lighter packs and sleeping and cooking gear along with rain shells plus tents. It is a case of getting a combination that I am happy with rather than what someone else is.

The end result is the individual needs to understand what is the maximum weight they can carry without breaking down and not exceed that. Also train as they plan to walk. I tend to keep a pretty consistent pack weight by changing the luxury level. This means I know what to expect on the longer walks. A trap is doing overnight walks at one weight and then overloading for the longer walks. The younger you are the better the chance of getting fit on a walk but not so certain of that the older you get.

Cheers

[Snowzone]

Hi
A trap is doing overnight walks at one weight and then overloading for the longer walks. The younger you are the better the chance of getting fit on a walk but not so certain of that the older you get.

Cheers

Or the other way round. I've been guilty of overloading on shorter easier walks because it was going to be simple

[Mafeking09]

Great posts - ahhh better than work. Now I feel better. 20kgs is about it. I too have started the Overland track with a mega pack - dumb move. Great to be a hero in the carpark but it eventually does you in.

Watch the weather comrades as we head out Saturday morning - expecting a nice day Saturday then the odd bit of precipitation. I did work a year down the West Coast. The standard joke was it only rained twice a year- before Christmas and after Christmas.

[sthughes]

Great posts - ahhh better than work. Now I feel better. 20kgs is about it. I too have started the Overland track with a mega pack - dumb move. Great to be a hero in the carpark but it eventually does you in.

The OT is a great place for a heavy pack. On my first OT trip I started with 27kg and as it is pretty easy walking it was no hassle at all. I think next time I'd be happy to increase that a little so as to be able to maintain the full 8 days on luxury quisine rather than "suffering" 2 or nights on normal bushwalking food.

For harder tracks I would however not dream of going that heavy, for a week I aim for about 20kg + water (add a couple of kilos in winter). That's sharing nothing and doing it in comfort (2 man tent, deserts, dry clothes at night etc.).

Depends a lot who you walk with too. If they are hard to keep up to then I have to re-think some of my weight!

[jacko1956]

I think Frenchy84's post has one of the key things to watch for, match your pack contents to your pack.
I'm about 90kg, 6 foot and in reasonable nick for 55.
I try not to carry more than 16-17kg anywhere.
With this weight I walk fast and use a lightweight pack (ULA Circuit) and love it.
If I carry more than this my pack is a real pain literally.
If everything you want to put in your pack is more than 15kg, use a 2-3kg pack.
If your pack is more than 23-25kg total, I personally think you need to reassess what you carry whatever your bodyweight.

[corvus]

G'day jacko1956,
I understand what you are saying however I am nearly 65 weigh around 73kg reasonably fit but at times when not sharing have carried over 1/3rd of my body weight on longer walks.
Hate to keep mentioning the Tasmanian thing but at times I just needed to ensure I was properly equipped( for me) for all seasons,I must confess that I use a bombproof WE Karijini 90lt pack which is around 3.2kg but the rest of my kit is relatively LW and on overnighter on a share gear walk with my Adult son I can get down to around 15kg with food .
corvus

[ILUVSWTAS]

I think Frenchy84's post has one of the key things to watch for, match your pack contents to your pack.
I'm about 90kg, 6 foot and in reasonable nick for 55.
I try not to carry more than 16-17kg anywhere.
With this weight I walk fast and use a lightweight pack (ULA Circuit) and love it.
If I carry more than this my pack is a real pain literally.
If everything you want to put in your pack is more than 15kg, use a 2-3kg pack.
If your pack is more than 23-25kg total, I personally think you need to reassess what you carry whatever your bodyweight.

I agree. I carry a heavy duty pack, 60l and it had done me for an 11 day trip including food. 19kg. And this included enough safety gear to get me through some of the worst Tasmanian weather you'd hope to encounter for a few days.

[zac150]

Interesting thread, I weight my pack pre food and water as I feel this gives me my set pack weight i.e no mater if I am walking for 3, 4 or 10 days the staples are there just food and water changes. For me the pack weight is between 10 & 11 kg depending on how many people are in the group walking with us to share gear and the conditions. In a group of six the weight would be 10kg + food and water. I usually carry 2l of water and between 1kg and 1.5kg of food per day so a 7 day walk would see me carry between 18.5& 19.5kg.

On a recent 3 day walk my pack was 19.5kg and included and extra 1kg of food plus 3.5kg of wine.

A little weird but I actually have the weight of everything I own in a spreadsheet and add / remove gear to find the best balance for the forthcoming trip based on conditions etc. I have found that doing this seems to make me a little more ruthless and I now tend to come back from trips having used everything I carried.

[Strider]

A little weird but I actually have the weight of everything I own in a spreadsheet and add / remove gear to find the best balance for the forthcoming trip based on conditions etc.

Me too, and I know a few others that do this also. Really opens your eyes as to which items are most affecting your baseweight!

[Ent]

Hi

Spreadsheeting the weights is something I do for the longer walks but as a gear freak I change rather like the weather so hard to keep up. Also, I vacillate between “ghee light stuff is great” to “wow the old traditional gear is reliable”. Personal experience plays a big role as been cold wet and miserable tends to leave an impression.

As mentioned by a few there are the basic rules.
1. Take gear that can deal with all reasonably expected conditions.
2. Ensure that your pack can handle the gear with comfort.
3. Never exceed your own personal weight limit.
4. Avoid getting into bragging rights ranging for carrying the heaviest or lightest pack. Carry what suits you and your style.

I am rather amazed how a few things over the last few years have changed the ballpark. Such as:
1. Tent weight has dropped dramatically with silicon nylon and no doubt will further with Cuban fibre. Also the 9mm pole has proven ok compared to the 10mm ones.
2. 750-850 loft light weight sleeping bags are now cheaper and available in various lengths.
3. Similar 750-850 loft jackets and now pants has lighted camp clothing and improved the comfort levels.
4. Sleeping mats like the Neo Air have dramatically reduced weight and volume.
5. Cooking with gas and using the light weight stoves has slashed cooking gear weight.
6. Light weight rain shells are coming out and changing from excessively fragile to reasonable care required.
7. Conversely, the abundance of electronic gadgets such as PLBs, GPS, Mobile Phones and mega batteries plus protective cases has worked to increase bulk and pack weight.
The above means that the 90 litre pack is rather overkill nowadays unless you are a mule or heading for a luxury, extreme snow, climbing, camera, or mega long walk. Even 75 litres is looking rather excessive. This means significant savings in pack size and weight can be had.

Personally no a fan of compromising the harness nor pack toughness. I am a One Planet tragic but went over to a Lowe Alpine Nanon 50+10 litre pack. The harness is probably fine for many people but not for me as I am very deep in the chest. But still on the light weight push I on this forum brought a second hand OP Shadow. Not sure if the medium back length is right for me as they do a long but a 1.6 kg pack of 56 litres that can carry 20 kilograms with comfort is impressive. Again I am not sure on the light weight canvas. Time will tell. But found last night that all my stuff fitted well. Maybe the long with an extra 4 litres will get me a pack for up to four days walk. I am XXL everything so a medium male would do longer walks again. Three years back I would have had no chance of fitting the stuff in.
Now the gear I take is not a UL minimalist fanatic’s stuff but sensible and comfortable stuff. Sure for mid winter snow camping the Neo Air goes out and the Exped Downmat goes in, the -1 sleeping bag is replaced with a -12, and the MSR Nook goes and the Nallo 2 comes in. This means back to the OP Styx 2 as snow shoes would be added as well.

It is amazing what weight and space savings have happened over just the last three years. If we as a group could collectively pooled stoves, phones, camera, and shared tents then further savings could be made. There is one side effect of light weight gear that I have noticed, people setting up to be fully self contained. In the past a group would plan out and share common stuff but nowadays many people are setting up for solo gear even if walking in a group. I do miss the large tent to socialise in and still if the proverbial hits the fan much prefer traditional type gear and think personally most ULs are evangelistic fanatics to their cause and forget that people walk differently to them. As for absolute weight target competitions, sorry as an XXL size guy I will lose before I begin so will not play that game. And I see nothing wrong with hauling 30 kilograms for a luxury wander if the mood so takes me.

Cheers

[zac150]

Ent, great post I agree with most if not all, of what you say.

I would add a fifth point to your basic rules and that is to match suitable gear i.e I might take a much lighter vest knowing I have my down jacket for the night, or I am happy with my heavier sleeping bag based on the fact I am carrying and ultra light tent.

[under10kg]

I did the south coast track with 12 kgs including food.
I took 700 gms of food a day which was plenty and I did not get hungry, and I think I took 9 days of food as I was doing a side trip.
With the new light modern gear you can get your pack weight well down from the 20 kg mark, be warm and comfortable at night too.
A light pack, 220 gms for the runners and you will laughing at the end of each day of walking!
If I bothered to buy the latest cuben tents and breathable cuben parkas I could save another 500gms.
The south coast track has little scrub so light weight is fine.

[ULWalkingPhil]

I've got my pack weight for winter use down to 8kg with a 1.5kg pack included in that weight. Just add food and water. Recent hike through the gold coast hinterland my pack with 3 days water and food 12kg.

One year ago on a overnight hike at the coastal track at royal national park my pack weight was in excess of 23kg. I'll never carry that weight again. You really don't need to carry that sort of weight if you purchase wisely.

[walkinTas]

Looks like pack will be around 19.5kg and feels a bit lighter than other trips (gas has saved me kgs). I hear of 15KG packs for 7 day walks - they must go seriously light on food?

Given that you are about to leave, there is not much you can do to lighten your load now. So really, its a matter of two things for you right now. Do you have sufficient food and gear to be safe? Is there anything you absolutely don't need and could leave behind?

As far as food goes, you are going to be burning a lot of energy, so you need sufficient calories/kilojoules to replace the energy you use. Otherwise you'll loose weight and consume fat and muscle tissue. The longer the walk, the more important that is. Therefore, on a long walk, the first question about food isn't volume or weight or taste, its nutrition: the right energy return, the right protein/fibre/sugar mix, and don't forget vitamins and electrolytes. Personally, I believe that high energy bars are the best bang for your bucks. You can save a lot of weight by getting your cooking and food right.

Remember, every litre of water costs a kilo, but you'll drink nothing less that 2 litres a day and if its hot, you might double that. I always carry 2 litres of water. I know others carry just one litre and fill up often.

Long term, lightening the load is about considering each and every purchase you make. Some folk can only afford one set of gear, and have to buy gear they can use year round. This is most of us when we first start walking. In this case we probably buys 3 season gear and chooses walks to match the gear. Sometimes walkers will have a specific walk in mind and just buy gear for that walk. Later, when we are either more experienced or have the money to buy extra gear, then we can consider having gear for different seasons and different reasons.

Either way, one set of gear, or multiple sets, one needs to look carefully at the gear before purchasing. Concentrate first on the BIG 4. It is hard sometimes to get the full picture, but these days I take my time and try for a well-rounded look at gear to get a good idea of what is available. That's where these forum can really help. I then start with a list of my needs and desires and look for gear that matches. That's very personal. My needs and desires are not your needs or your desires.

So, think long and hard about what is right for you and what you can/will tolerate, and what you need and/or want. For example, tents: - Could you sleep in a bivy; - or would your needs be met by a tent without a floor; - is a light 1000mm/2000mm floor OK for you; - would you always carry a separate ground sheet; - are you looking for a heavier 5000mm floor; - or do you want a single or double walled tent; - are there times you'd camp without a fly; - should your tent be single pitch or inner first or outer first; - do you want a tent for the snow or a tent for windy spots or a tent for summer or a tent for year round; - would you be happy with a mesh inner tent or are you hoping for full inner walls; - how important is a vestibule to you, do you cook in your tent; - 1 person or two or more; - on your trip are you likely to be tent bound (room, comfort, condensation).

And then there are technical issues about material, design, strength, how well the tent is make and how it performs. Trying to get ones head around all that isn't easy at first. So we read, we find people that do know, we ask questions and we take our time to make decisions. If you have time, then ask what is the advantage of each variation in design and why is one better or worst than the other for YOU.

Whatever approach you use, get yourself a short list of products that suit your needs, then you can compare pack volume and pack weight and choose wisely. My advice, don't start with weight as your only goal, not before you've looked at everything else. The minimalists, with very light gear, have usually arrived at that point over time and with careful consideration.

Over time I have been concentrating on improving my winter gear. I have been able to buy stronger, warmer gear and, at the same time, buy gear that takes up less room (smaller volume) and is lighter. My big 4 have come down from a 23.5 litres to 14.8 litres, and from 7.8 kg to 4.8 kg. At the same time, I have gone from 3 season below the snowline, to 4 season snow camping. The point is that's me, what do YOU want out of YOUR gear.

[tasadam]

Just thought I would throw my 2 bob in.

Body weight, typical 62 - 63kg
Longest walk and heaviest load - 15 days, 32 kg at start. I had the food, so it got a lot lighter as the days progressed.
Typical weight at start for a multi day walk, around 27kg
Weight at a recent overnighter, fully self sufficient, around 23kg.

I should add that I carry a lot of camera equipment, and have purposely not calculated what my pack would weigh if I left the camera stuff at home. I believe it would be quite reasonable.

Typical food weight per person per day, between 570 & 600 grams.

My thoughts on sensible weight are between a quarter and a third your body weight, but there are a lot of variables to this, as mentioned.
My variable is how sensible I am (or aren't...)

[Strider]

I hear of 15KG packs for 7 day walks - they must go seriously light on food?

My baseweight is 11kg, and that includes a 3kg tent. Assuming a smaller tent, baseweight would be around 9kg.

9kg baseweight + 7kg food = 16kg.

15kg isn't that ridiculous when you think about it logically.

[sjf]

Interesting discussion

Recently did the OLT with a starting weight of 20kg, 7 nights. Food was definitely the heaviest component so it got a lot lighter towards the end

Took too many clothes, but that is a thing I guess you learn with more experience.

Went lightweight on the tent (tarptent), pack (osprey 44l talon), mat (exped 7 downmat) and most other gear, none of it let me down.

Next aim ... 17kg start weight for 8 nights, I reckon it just comes down to how much you want to eat and how much you can put up with being stinky !

Base weight (assuming that is everything except food, water, clothes) is well under 10kg so it should not be all that hard.

Adios

[jacko1956]

"I reckon it just comes down to how much you want to eat and how much you can put up with being stinky !"
Definitely!!!

I'm sorry this thread is getting a bit hijacked from the original point but I think the subject matter is worth friendly discussion.

I carry a Tarptent, NeoAir, titanium alcohol stove and cookware.
For the rest I have two changes of socks and jocks (I consider that fussy as the second pair of each is a bit of overkill) and eat predominantly noodles from the third day on.
I carry fresh food and real milk for first day or so which means first day or two I shed several kilos of packweight and eat well.
After that I eat less calories than I burn until next resupply.
I don't carry "changes" of clothes - only layers.
Not recommended for all but I walk fairly upright and enjoy my surroundings.
I personally could not enjoy hiking with anything 25% or more of my 90kg bodyweight. The sight of people with much less body mass than me carrying packs well over 20kg leaves me feeling amazed. I do NOT criticise it, I just stress that I wouldn't do it. In extreme cases however I think it gets a bit ridiculous. As an example of what I think is someone who needs to rethink their packweight I submit the following YouTube link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqLPhw0J ... uO-86M0hQ=
I don't know the people involved but I see that level of weight in a pack as not only detracting from the experience but being a bit dangerous.

In severe weather or in some other situations I may get cold or hungry for richer food but I am not that poorly equipped that I am in any danger. I accept that there may be conditions I encounter that leave me more uncomfortable than someone with a much heavier pack but that is the trade off for all those other hours where I am strolling along with my poles ticking ahead lightly looking for snakes and spider webs, while those with better food, more clothes and 4 season tents toil along plowing their poles into the ground like a fishermen poling a punt across the shallows.
Each to their own or as the yanks say "hike your own hike".

[ULWalkingPhil]

Some great tips and advice here. Have to agree with high energy bars for low weight and high energy input, this is what I usually take for lunch, depending on the walk, less than a few days I generally also take a sandwich with me for lunch. It all depends on how much space I have left in my pack, of late there's not been a lot of space left in my pack, as I've reduced my pack size down to a 45 litre volume pack. Does not leave room for an sandwich or two by the time i fit all my winter gear.

Think I'll need to upsize my pack slightly, I'm missing my Aarn Load Limo Pack. Regretting not taking that pack with me on my current adventure in the gold coast hinterland. My Aarn Load Limo is to large for me, but it is a lot more comfortable to wear than the Jansport 45 litre pack I have with me. I miss my Aarn pack. Eventually I'll purchase one of the smaller Aarn packs, something in the 50 to 60 litre range would be ideal. Will probably increase my overall pack weight by half a kilo over the Jansport pack I'm using now, but at least I don't receive any upper back discomfort with a Aarn pack, for this reason I can put up with the extra half kilo.

[tasadam]

As an example of what I think is someone who needs to rethink their packweight I submit the following YouTube link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqLPhw0J ... uO-86M0hQ=

Since when do you put the pack on before you stand up?
As you say, each to their own...

[Moondog55]

And
For those of us who are still using microfibre clothing and dressing for the snow often the need is for a bigger pack, the newer clothing is great but it does not pack down/compress like ultra light down will.
I tried to get all my winter gear into a 70 litre pack in the US and it was simply not possible, this is me and my gear and I do know of others who can do it.
One thing that has a great bearing on pack size is your own body, if you are bigger and taller your clothes are simply bigger, as is the sleeping gear.
I'll buy new lighter more compact gear when what I have is worn out/unrepairable but in the meantime I find it hard to pack for winter and get away with less than 25/30 kilos including fuel and food for a week, and this isn't counting skis and /or snowshoes, rope or ice-tools.
Summer it will be a couple of kilos less depending on how much water I need to carry but I always carry a minimum of 2 litres in winter and 3 or more in summer