To Tarp?

[McNazgul]

Hi Everyone,

I've been toying with the idea of sleeping under a tarp for a little while.

I currently have a 1 man freestanding tent and while its not really heavy I would really like to try and save some weight in this area. I am planning on doing some long walks this year and cutting weight will be a massive help as well as the simplicity. I find that I want simpler things as I get older. I know some light weight tents are VERY light but i like the tarp and want to know more about the practicalities of one.

What I am seeking is advice and experiences from those that have used, use frequently and those that use exclusively a tarp for cover. Everything from site selection, weather, comfort, bugs and wildlife. Everything.

Recommendations on Tarps are more than welcome. I want as much and varied input as possible.

Hope you can help.

[Mark F]

Using a tarp is a personal choice and so is likely to require you to try out several options before deciding on what works for you. Tarps grade from the basic to what is best described as single skin tents.

Flat tarps (including those with cantenary ridges) are the most basic version and can, with skill and attention to site selection, work well. Generally better for 3 season use and in sheltered locations.

Enclosed tarps such as pyramids, hexamids etc provide more shelter and so are easier to use in more exposed conditions.

I started with flat tarps in the 1970s in NSW mainly confined to the Blue Mountains and similar country. Used a tent for exposed areas such as SW Tasmania, KNP etc. and changed over to using a conventional tent. I later tried a flat tarp (MLD Cuben Grace Duo) again but was not "comfortable" with it and moved to an enclosed tarp (SMD Gatewood Cape with net inner) and later Zpacks Hexamid and finally a ZPacks Solplex for the higher entrance and built in floor. The "not comfortable" was not due to any specific failing of the flat tarp or lack of skill in using it but more psychological. All these options weighed in between 450g and 600g complete with pegs and net inner so weight wasn't a serious factor. The ZPacks units have worked very well in the Pyrenees, Snowy Mountains, South Coast Track, WOJ etc.

I also have a light weight tent (Terra Nova Laser Comp 1) for seriously exposed conditions eg, Main Range, SW Tasmania non coastal etc. While one can survive in these places with a tarp I do value a bit of comfort.

[McNazgul]

Thanks for the reply.

You're absolutely right with it coming down to preference. I think i just feel cramped in the tent at the moment. I'm 6'3 and 100kg. The 1 man tents don't seem fit me.

3 season use is as far as i'm extending at the moment. I guess i'm looking for some more room without the weight. Cake and eat it too lol. Maybe a 3x3 tarp?

[Davidf61]

Yes a 3 x 3 Tarp. [ Just ordered 1 off Terra Rosa, so I'm biased! ]

I'm just about exclusively tarps or pyramids these days, and after using cheapish heavy tarps of all sizes/shapes, I believe around 9 or 10 feet square gives the best balance of weight/versatility/protection going, at least for me. Have smaller tarps, just get annoyed at the lack of protection mainly, if it rains or is decently windy it always seems borderline. With a 3x3 you can have enough room for a "bedroom" and space to do stuff as well, and there's probably 6-8 useful ways they can be erected. NOT having a floor is so handy sometimes. Plus you can make a big tarp smaller, but not vice versa.

Still trying nests and bivi's, will never come to a resolution there! Painters drop sheet for a 5 gram floor if required.

Go to Bunnings, spend $10 on a blue poly tarp in 3x3, head for your local park with poles/pegs and string and amuse yourself endlessly trying all the variations going. At least until the Police show up and ask what you're doing because the nosy old bag across the street thinks you're some homeless dude camping rough. Ask me how I know....

[McNazgul]

Fantastic. Terra Rosa makes great gear. The workshop is localish to me and a mate had a custom, mid tent made. Great quality and service.

The 3x3 is what i'm leaning towards. Seems to have the right combination of size and weight. At this stage i'm looking at the DD superlight tarp. Just for availability and price. Not that I want to wreck any gear but I would feel better about putting a hole in that than a nice one from Terra Rosa or a cuben tarp.

Keep the info coming. Haven't heard too many downsides yet. What am I missing? Has anyone gone to sleep and woken up in a puddle?

[whitefang]

I love tarps. However, be mindful of where you set up. I haven't woken in a puddle yet, but I almost did one night. Where I was camped was on clay and the water would not soak in to the ground so I had to make a few channels to drain some water away.

The other thing is that if you opt for a larger size tarp that's made from silnylon the weight will possibly start to creep up towards what some of the lighter tarp tents weigh.

[Davidf61]

I think the "no floor" is the secret here, along with site selection of course. Since a tarp is so flexible in its use, as long as you can find just enough space to fit your sleeping arrangement [ say 2m x 1m ], with a little bit of thinking you can set your tarp around/over/next to most obstacles. Most people seem to think you need a massive flat area to set them up but I will look for useful features in the landscape to use WITH the tarp. A small sawn off tree stump or flat rock becomes an inside table, a trench is room for legs to dangle in, a rock wall or fallen tree is a free "wall ", you just have remember you have lots of tie outs and string so you can adapt to your surroundings.

A tarp with one side open to the view, 3 sides battened down, small campfire fizzing away, that's the biz.

[Davidf61]

Hello RLGM12, sorry e-mail on this site never works for me.

Yes the Police felt obliged to come and say hello after the nosy old bag assumed I was up to no good. I have a tiny back lawn with a Hills Hoist in the middle of it so I often go the park to set stuff up or try new things. Cops were fine, we had a laugh over it. My suburb if full of retirees so I guess some have nothing better to do than peek out of windows.....

[Franco]

have you had a look at the Tarptent shelters ?
You can get them fully enclosed (bug proof) but still tarp like from about 700g, or just buy the fly only , if bugs don't bother you, of something like the Notch and use it fully open or closed as you like.

https://www.tarptent.com/notch.html
(fly only under Extras, 450g plus pegs and your walking sticks)
franco@tarptent

[McNazgul]

This is all great info guys. So far i'm liking the general consensus.

I haven't had a detailed look at the tarptents but i'll be sure to now. Thanks. In your view, what is the advantage of the tarptent over a tarp?

Just to keep the conversation flowing - Has anyone got, used or seen a cuben tarp? I'd like to hear opinions, pros/cons etc.

[Mark F]

Three of the tarps I mentioned in my first post are cuben (MDL, and the 2 ZPacks). My view is that for tarps and flat panelled tents/tarp tents cuben is an excellent material but if you have designs with curved poles or that require stretch in the fabric to get it to pitch properly then the almost zero stretch of cuben becomes a problem.

[Rlgm12]

On my last trip.
There were these two folks down at King Hut.

One of them had this low riding single skin (tarp) tents
It looks like it had two vertical poles.
Lots of tie outs.
I unfortunately can't recall the name.

It's logo, was 'ultralight' something in white, on the dark green material.

It looked like a elongated hexamid tarp shelter.

I know this is far fetched, but anyone know anything like what I'm describing here?

On another note, anyone got experience with Wilderness Equipments range of tarps?

[whitefang]

I have a cuben tarp and previously had a silnylon one. Both flat tarps. I prefer the cuben. I find it a lot easier to get a taut pitch that stay taut. And cuben is so much lighter. The zpacks ones Mark F suggests are what I would love to have. I just couldn't afford it at the time.

[Franco]

In your view, what is the advantage of the tarptent over a tarp?

Ease and speed of setting them up and weather protection .
You can ,say, have good wind protection from a tarp but you need to set it up for it. If the wind was not there or changes direction, most tarpers would need to re-set the rig.
With a Notch, as an example, you just open up or pull down the sides according to he need. Don't have to re-stake.
Of course you can set up a tarp very low to start with but then you have a sort of bivy set up that you need to crawl in and out of and without space to easily get changed , read sitting up and cooking.
But of course that is how I see it and the reason why I became attracted to the brand in the first place.

[Franco]

Rlgm 12
this logo ?

[McNazgul]

This is great. You guys are really helping me sort through what i want.

What i'm thinking so far:-

-Cuben fiber(DCF)
-3x3
-Preferably Australian made
-Best value

Can anyone add to this?

[whitefang]

To my knowledge, the only person making something similar to what you're asking for is Evan at Terra Rosa Gear. He offers a 3mx2.6 cuben tarp for $560. Personally, for that cost I feel that something like the zpacks solplex or hexamid are better value. They are a tad more expensive due to the exchange rate, but they are fully enclosed if need be for weather protection. The same reasons that Franco has mentioned are the same things I feel are the downfalls of a flat tarp.

[Mark F]

If looking a ZPacks it is always worth checking the Bargain Bin. There was quite a bit in it after Christmas. Picked up an Arc Blast pack with $50 off - covered the postage. Said it was slightly used but I can see no evidence of usage.

[Orion]

If you just want a flat Cuben tarp you could save money by cutting and taping it together yourself. It isn't that hard.

For example, the 3.2x2.6m Terra Rosa Cuben tarp translates into 7 yards of 0.51g/moz/yd2 fabric from zpacks.
The fabric alone would cost $260 AUD at the current exchange rate. Add in shipping, the double sided tape
you'd need and a few odds and ends and you'd still be way ahead of $560+shipping, or at least I'd guess so.
And if you're lucky Trump will say something really stupid and cause the US Dollar to fall further.

A tarptent would be way more convenient. But heavier. You have to decide what matters.

[McNazgul]

Yeah thats spot on. i'd really like to support an Aussie manufacturer but the price to do so is prohibitive.

I've literally just been looking at the DIY route. I've got a checkered past with DIY and i'm reluctant so spend all that money to just ruin it.

I'll be watching the US dollar intently as I think that this will be my safest bet. The US cottage companies have a lot of experience with this stuff and seem to represent better value.

Anyone have experience with the HMG (Hyperlite Mountain Gear) tarps?

[Davidf61]

I've often wondered at the economics behind Cuben from a cottage industry perspective.

The material is not cheap to buy, and I imagine it would take a little longer to assemble various goods because you simply can't afford mistakes during manufacture. And to go with the premium price tag is an expectation by the customer of perfect build quality as well, so this all takes time=money in [expensive seasonal ] labour costs. A lot of stuff is made to order so there is no "economy of scale" going on. It would be measure 6 times cut once. There can't be huge margins on this stuff so I guess we should be thankful for the dedication by these retailers.

Back to the original poster's comments, without trying to step on toes here , the question was about tarps, but as usual it turns away from the subject and heads off on tangents like "tarptents" or tents. In my view a tarp is a piece of material with just strings around the edges, that you kind of construct your self to what is required [ie-flexibility] and everything from tarptents up are "tents" [ie-fixed].

I still say go buy $10 worth of blue poly tarp, have a play with it, sleep overnight in the backyard in it, then think about lashing out on something exxy like cuben......

[simonm]

Since Cubic Tech was bought out by Dyneema DSM their pricing structure changed so importing Cuben Fiber (or Dyneema Composite Fabric as it's now officially called) into Australia at a decent rate now requires a big investment in dollars. Last time I checked you would really need to purchase at least 250m at one time which would cost about $8000AUD not including freight. So take that into account when comparing local prices. Evan at Terra Rosa would not be getting Cuben at a very good price I would imagine.

Its just not a worthwhile investment for a small manufacturer at this point in time, and is why we stopped stocking it, and ended our plans to produce Cuben tarps. Though I always look at it and wonder what if....?

[Davidf61]

[quote="McNazgul"]Yeah thats spot on. i'd really like to support an Aussie manufacturer but the price to do so is prohibitive.

I think Australian "cottage" guys/girls are competitive enough.

I've just bought a Tarp off Terra Rosa, a quilt off "Undercling-mike" and bits and pieces off Tier Gear [ oh and I need more!]. I did the math/googling/run-around, and I'm happy with purchases/price AND service. I can see myself spending much more in the future as well.

[Franco]

"I've often wondered at the economics behind Cuben from a cottage industry perspective."
One of the US cottage manufacturers gave up on Cuben a year or two ago and another one right now, after having spent a lot of money on equipment to handle it, is thinking very hard on what to do with it. So, I too wonder about it...

[McNazgul]

Hey guys. Thanks for all of your input on this. I have decided to get a tarp.

I have also decided to go with a DCF 3x3 or similar. I figure the large size is more versatile. It will also compliment my UL hammock set up. So it can be used for 2 different setups.

[Nuts]

My main concern with a tarp / sleeping bag combo would be snake bedfellows. Not so bad in the cold, at least they have to enter somewhere around your face..

Other than that, for CF and a simple tarp, i'd go with DIY as Orion says (myself), CF is made for DIY'ers.

[simonm]

My main concern with a tarp / sleeping bag combo would be snake bedfellows. Not so bad in the cold, at least they have to enter somewhere around your face..

Other than that, for CF and a simple tarp, i'd go with DIY as Orion says (myself), CF is made for DIY'ers.

I agree go DIY for a Cuben tarp, and probably the cheapest source at the moment is Zpacks.

[Nuts]

I see those factory prices, would be a risky outlay, even getting outside the realm of a group buy.. of one fabric weight.

[dunamis]

I'm planning on going DIY tarp over my bivy so a trip down to see Simon for some fabric is on the cards


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[simonm]

I'm planning on going DIY tarp over my bivy so a trip down to see Simon for some fabric is on the cards


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Let me know, I will put the kettle on.