Pack Weights

[Macca81]

Ok so i got a little bored this evening, and decided i would see just what my base pack weight is. With pictures

I have been slowly working on bringing down my weight (both of me and my pack) and after weighing my pack to fly in to Melaluca 2 years ago and having a pack weight of 22.5kg (including food) i am now down to 11.9kg (no food, but that didnt weigh 10kg and weighs even less now!)
I still have a couple of areas to work on, namely my tent, camp shoes and camp clothes. My tent weight is soon to go down anyway, as you will see further down this post.

First Pic! Everything that i take on every trip, excluding the clothing i walk in.


Second Pic, everything packed and ready to go into the pack. Weights are included (they add up to 12kg, but my kitchen scales are not that accurate. The full pack was weighed on scales accurate to 100g)


Third Pic, and this is where my next weight saving will come in. I just need to get an Underquilt (~250-400g) and that will replace my tent and thermarest (>2.6kg) with something in the region of 1.3kg) The tarp could go MUCH lighter. Just by swapping out the standard guy lines to some hootchie cord i have laying around i could shave off 120g... Making my own could reduce the fabric weight by... more...
It also takes up less room (this is something i like more than weight loss... also means i can look for a smaller[lighter] pack...)



Anyway, just thought i would share this with everyone. I would have put it in the lightweight section of the forum, but then i realised that doesnt exist anymore... So everyone else can look at it too


Oh, BTW, i aim to be at 7kg before food within a year

[Macca81]

Eh, that second pic was much easier to read on my computer, i think photobucket scaled me down a bit...

[andrewbish]

Hi Macca

Good pics.

It would be helpful to see a list of the gear. If you don't already have something similar, you might find this simple gear calculator I put together in Excel useful. I uploaded it to my blog just yesterday. It totals all your items and provides you with the base & full loaded pack weights, as well as your skin-out weight. It also shows your pack weight as a % of your body weight and how you compare against a UL scale.

As a starting comment, your pack at 3kg is pretty heavy, so there's scope there to get the weight down significantly.

Andrew

[Tony]

Hi Macca,

As the writing on the photo is a bit hard to read a list would help.

As Andrew has pointed out, look at your 3000g pack first as this is where you can save the most weight, OP make some nice light packs these days, I use Golite Jam2 and a Pinnacle, both well below a kilo.

Some other bits of gear that stood out to me.

Camp shoes 960g, there are a lot of lighter alternatives I use some cheap copy crocs at 297g, these double as wading shoes.

Stainless Steel bottle, Stainless Steel is heavy, do you really need a SS bottle, I use plastic water bottles the ones that you buy water from a shop in that weigh about 20g each for my day water and a collapsable 2l Platypus bladder 36g for evening water.

1800g for clothes seems a lot, posting a list of clothes would help.

Tony

[Macca81]

Yeah I'll post a list once I am back on the computer...

Funny that you mentioned shoes and clothes, as i mentioned that's an area to cut back on too
The biggest weight in the clothing is my jacket, and that is just because it is a heavy windstopper, as i still haven't gotten around to getting a lighter down jacket. Other stuff is just thermals, a pair of socks and a light pair of shorts and shirt.

Shoes, i refuse to wear crocs, but i am looking into the vibram fivefingers sprint.

You also mention the pack, and i also mention that as my gear takes up less space, I'm looking for a smaller pack

I'm liking that we seem to be on the same track...


The SS bottle, i just like that one... I know I could go plastic, but i just like those sig style bottles.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

[kymboy]

Thanks for the link Andrew. Gotta love excel

Hi Macca. You can easily go much lighter on the pack. My One Planet WBA is 1.55 kg which isn't ultralight, but even there you've lost 1.5 kg off your current pack. Have to agree about the camp shoes - you can easily lose another half kilo or more on some anti-Crocs or similar lightweight option. Then there's the jacket and tent. .. and the list goes on. All good fun Good luck with the downsizing. Your back and knees will thank you for it.

K

[ninjapuppet]

the nit-picking begins...

Macca, its initially a painful process. I had alot of trouble initally letting go of alot of items. These items were accumulated from various kathamndu sales like a deck of cards, a small "lightweight" chess board game that was 300g, a minidisc player, a guidebook, .... the list went on.

Like everyone else, it took massive uphill slog with a heavy pack and lots of pain before I realised why people far less fit than me were powering on more easily than me. packweight seemed to be the only logical answer

[Nuts]

Ur doing fine Macca. Packs, no one make the perfect pack, iv'e been to lightweight 'nirvana' n back. Ironically I was hesitant about some of the lighter ones I tried (or still have) so I went back to canvas and bought a One Planet (Vertex).. never really damaged the light ones but then the rats chewed into my new pack And.. when I cut off the (chewed) ice axe loops it was still wet from the walk. Out of curiosity i threw it on the scales weighed 200grams more than dry just in what was drawn into the fabric.. and its one of their smallest packs.. Dyneema/nylon appears a good solid pack material, pity they (OP) went for even lighter canvas instead..

It can get expensive testing equipment but I have found letting go of tradition (afterall it is 'bushwaling' not some ancient craft and guild..) leaps are being made. Some hold on to nostalgia like its a crib comforter I like that sleeping bag Macca.

[Tony]

the nit-picking begins...

Macca, its initially a painful process. I had alot of trouble initally letting go of alot of items. These items were accumulated from various kathamndu sales like a deck of cards, a small "lightweight" chess board game that was 300g, a minidisc player, a guidebook, .... the list went on.

Like everyone else, it took massive uphill slog with a heavy pack and lots of pain before I realised why people far less fit than me were powering on more easily than me. packweight seemed to be the only logical answer

Well put ninjapuppet,

Going lightweight is about making do with a lighter option, and after a while, you wonder why you ever needed or carried the heavier one.

I am much more than twice Maccas age and I love the look on much younger bushwalkers face when I past them at pace up a big hill, the same as when I do mountain running races I love seeing the look on twenty year olds when I pass them up the steep bits.

Tony

[Nuts]

ha ha, i picture you doing a quick circle around them Tony. Its a good point, what is 'necessary'. Nothing wrong with just 'moving the house to a more scenic location' either

[Tony]

Nothing wrong with just 'moving the house to a more scenic location' either

Hi Nuts,

When I retire which I hope will be next year, I am thinking about moving to the big pretty island to our south to practice my lightweight walking in some real bushwalking country, though I cannot decide which town to move too, Launceston or Hobart Town.

Tony

[wayno]

i picked up a Black diamond infinity pack, 1.7kg 60L, their 75 litre is only a hundred grams more, has a belt harness that uses a ball swivel joint to attach to the pack allowing the belt to pivot freely while still holding the pack weight
the shoulder straps are joined by a cable that runs under the pivot . one strap can lengthen as the other one shortens automatically.
still made of reasonably strong material, not ripstop.
best packs i've had. I only bought them because of the weight, but i'm sold on their harness system. although if you're doing a lot of scrambling on rough terain with the 75 litre and it's loaded to the top you might find it doesnt hold tight enough to keep the load totally steady

[Nuts]

I am thinking about moving to the big pretty island to our south to practice my lightweight walking in some real bushwalking country, though I cannot decide which town to move too, Launceston or Hobart Town.

Tony

I spent 4 yrs at uni in Canberra, not that bad, like many things it sounds worse from those without experience. As for where to live in Tassie, iirc you do have some boots somewhere, are they scarpas or steel capped blunnies (ftr i see neither as 'ideal') I dont think it makes a lot of difference where in Tassie, the central north /west is definitely more scenic and you could probably afford a town lol (though i would have similar considerations along the lines of what stibb said about guiding..)

[Macca81]

Like i said, it is a gradual process for me, i have never had any intention of just going light weight, it has always been a case of when i replace something i am more aware of its weight than i was in the past. There are things i wont change, like my jetboil and my container full of coffee/sugar/milk powder etc, because my goal isnt ultra light, it is comfort. To me, having a coffee when i get to camp and the speed in which i can have it, are a comfort i would like to continue. On the other hand the unnecessary weight in the form of my tent and pack, dont offer me any more comfort than a lighter version.

Anyway, here is a list, just copied from a spreadsheet so not nice and neat. Weight is in grams, obviously. (again, not particularly accurate, as i stil dont have fancy digi scales but it works)

Pack One Planet Strezleki Black 3000
Tent S2S Dart 2300
Hammock DIY White 435
Tarp Oztrail Green 550
Pad Thermarest Prolite S 340
Quilt Nunatak Orange + Silk Liner + S2S Dry Sack 800
Footpad/Seat Blue CCF 40
Jetboil PCS Black JB 450
Fuel JB 100g 210
Bottle Silver Metal 1l 185
Coffee Container Protein Container w/ Drink Powders 350
Camp Gear S2S Drybag w/ Dry Gear 1800
Rain Gear MD Jacket and Misc Black Pants 950
Camp Shoes Keens 960
Deet Brown Heavy Duty / Green Sunscreen 100
Emergency Food Dehy Backcountry 220
1st Aid Kit Red Small 80
Day Pack S2S Silnylon Blue 70
Trowel Orange Plastic 70
Headlamp Petzl Tikka 90

[Macca81]

Ur doing fine Macca.

Cheers Nuts!

I like that sleeping bag Macca.

I do too, it is definitely my favourite piece of kit! (right next to my JetBoil)

[etrangere]

"nothing but the best of several brands will do "


That has to be one of the best one liners ever on this forum. Every time I see it I have a chuckle as I know that's one of my weaknesses and I'm sure the same for plenty of others on this forum too. It's a classic!

[Tony]

it is definitely my favourite piece of kit! (right next to my JetBoil)

Hi Macca,

The JetBoil Ti Sol is half the weight of the PCS and is a better performer, faster and more efficient, but it is yet to be approved here in Australia.

Tony

[Macca81]

"nothing but the best of several brands will do "


That has to be one of the best one liners ever on this forum. Every time I see it I have a chuckle as I know that's one of my weaknesses and I'm sure the same for plenty of others on this forum too. It's a classic!

I still get a chuckle every time i post... sad... hehe

[etrangere]

Tony,

I've actually got the Jetboil Ti Sol on order from Basegear.com. In regards to the weight when mention it a lot of times they are only refering to the differences in weight of the pot.

Once you take into account the weight of the whole system eg stands, cannister, pot support, cup etc you only save 92 gms.

Jetboil Zip + fuel cannister = 527 gms

Jetboil Ti Sol + fuel cannister = 435 gms

[corvus]

Yeah I'll post a list once I am back on the computer...

Funny that you mentioned shoes and clothes, as i mentioned that's an area to cut back on too

Shoes, i refuse to wear crocs, but i am looking into the vibram fivefingers sprint.


Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

Hey Macca81,
You are not serious about reducing pack weight by refusing to wear crocs real or $7.00 ones like mine from Rivers size 10 ,313g ,gees your Keens weigh more than my sleeping bag
Wont wear crocs but happy to wear heavier five finger whatsits, wonder if they would perform like the crocs geoskid wore when had to lend his boots to a mate who had a (boot failure dont ask) and we walked out from Pelion to Arm River Car Park and then up to Car at Maggs 17
corvus

[Tony]

Tony,

I've actually got the Jetboil Ti Sol on order from Basegear.com. In regards to the weight when mention it a lot of times they are only refering to the differences in weight of the pot.

Once you take into account the weight of the whole system eg stands, cannister, pot support, cup etc you only save 92 gms.

Jetboil Zip + fuel cannister = 527 gms

Jetboil Ti Sol + fuel cannister = 435 gms

Thanks etrangere,

I am not sure how you worked out those figures, the JetBoil website states teh PCS as 425g and the Ti Sol as 240g, that is a difference of 185g, if you add the pot support and the canister stand to either stove system then the weight difference would still be the same.

Tony

[Gusto]

i picked up a Black diamond infinity pack, 1.7kg 60L, their 75 litre is only a hundred grams more, has a belt harness that uses a ball swivel joint to attach to the pack allowing the belt to pivot freely while still holding the pack weight
the shoulder straps are joined by a cable that runs under the pivot . one strap can lengthen as the other one shortens automatically.

That harness uses a patent from Aarn Bodypacks.

if you're doing a lot of scrambling on rough terain with the 75 litre and it's loaded to the top you might find it doesnt hold tight enough to keep the load totally steady

Their 75 litre pack supposedly has a more stable harness than the 75. I would like to try that harness on just for interest sake. My current pack is comfortable and won't die another 15 years.

[Macca81]

Wont wear crocs but happy to wear heavier five finger whatsits, wonder if they would perform like the crocs geoskid wore when had to lend his boots to a mate who had a (boot failure dont ask) and we walked out from Pelion to Arm River Car Park and then up to Car at Maggs 17
corvus

Correct! I have tried crocs, and much like thongs and most any other slip-on type footwear, i just dont like them. The fact that i look like a tool is a minor point

The five finger whatsits, are made to be able to hike in, so i suspect they should be able to hold up to it should i have a boot blowout!

[Nuts]

Wouldn't you look like a tool in those five fingers? lol
Gaffa Tape (Duck Extreme) for boot blowouts.

ps its a shame geoskid doesn't come walking anymore. The best of several brands likely sit in the wardrobe.

[ninjapuppet]

Actually..... The US army has officially banned vibram five fingers. their reasoning? they look too silly.
http://slatest.slate.com/posts/2011/06/30/five_toe_shoes_military_toe_shoes_banned_by_military.html

Try to imagine a unit of GIs advancing on the enemy ranks shod in these. I would be terrified, frankly.

and on the topic of jetboil sol TI, here are my weights out of interest.

sea to summit x-mug 61 (not included but i use this in place of the issued lid since it fits perfectly)
lid 19
pot 123
base cup 33
orange legs for cannister 28
burner 103
optional pot stand 36 (not required if not using other pots)
jetboil hanging kit 44 ( i only use this for mountaineering or very hilly terrain)
new 100g jetboil canister 201

My typical setup would include the x-mug, pot, orange legs for cannister, burner and a cannister at 516g. this would obviously not be as light as an alcohol setup for shot trips but it would pull its weight for week long trips.
My mate also has a jetboil Ti, and his weights vary by as much as 13g on some parts compared to mine

uneducated annecdotal evidence still sees me using the msr reactor for mountaineering if snow melting is required.

[etrangere]

Tony,

I've actually got the Jetboil Ti Sol on order from Basegear.com. In regards to the weight when mention it a lot of times they are only refering to the differences in weight of the pot.

Once you take into account the weight of the whole system eg stands, cannister, pot support, cup etc you only save 92 gms.

Jetboil Zip + fuel cannister = 527 gms

Jetboil Ti Sol + fuel cannister = 435 gms

Thanks etrangere,

I am not sure how you worked out those figures, the JetBoil website states teh PCS as 425g and the Ti Sol as 240g, that is a difference of 185g, if you add the pot support and the canister stand to either stove system then the weight difference would still be the same.

Tony

Tony,

I had another look at the site to recheck those figures

If you look at the page for each product on the Jetboil site they list

Jetboil Ti Sol 240 gms for only the cup weight
Jetboil PCS 425 gms for the whole system

They have an asterix after the Jetboil Ti Sol specs indicating ( * system weight does not include pot support, fuel stabilizer and measuring cup). That asterix and note are not on the Jetboil PCS page.

If you then go to the Stove Comparison page the weights listed are:

Jetboil Ti Sol 8.5oz - 240g (minus pot support, fuel stabiliser AND CUP)
Jetboil PCS 12oz - 340g (minus pot support and fuel stabilizer) - I'm 'guessing' the 425g on the Jetboil PCS spec page does include those items

So it appears to be a 100g difference

Once you add the 198g for a cannister and the weight of the pot support, fuel stabiliser and cup the percentage difference would be even smaller.

Either way the website doesnt make it very easy or clear to make a quick direct comparison

[Tony]

Tony,

I had another look at the site to recheck those figures

If you look at the page for each product on the Jetboil site they list

Jetboil Ti Sol 240 gms for only the cup weight
Jetboil PCS 425 gms for the whole system

They have an asterix after the Jetboil Ti Sol specs indicating ( * system weight does not include pot support, fuel stabilizer and measuring cup). That asterix and note are not on the Jetboil PCS page.

If you then go to the Stove Comparison page the weights listed are:

Jetboil Ti Sol 8.5oz - 240g (minus pot support, fuel stabiliser AND CUP)
Jetboil PCS 12oz - 340g (minus pot support and fuel stabilizer) - I'm 'guessing' the 425g on the Jetboil PCS spec page does include those items

So it appears to be a 100g difference

Either way the website doesnt make it very easy or clear to make a quick direct comparison

Hi etrangere,

Thanks for those figures, I should have looked more closely, JetBoil does have a reputation of fiddling the figures a bit, I have not yet read a stove review that has replicated the JetBoils claims of boiling times, my test results are the same, though what I have read is that they stop timing when bubbles appear on the bottom of the pot, in my testing facilities in my shed 600m altitude this around 82ºC.

Once you add the 198g for a cannister and the weight of the pot support, fuel stabiliser and cup the percentage difference would be even smaller.

I am not sure why adding the canister, pot support and fuel stabiliser makes any difference between the two stoves as from what I can see they are the same for both stoves, maybe I am wrong again, the measuring cup on the Sol Ti may be lighter than the PCS cup but I am unable to find any specs on the cups. While the canister is necessary for the stove to be used in the field, the Pot support, cup and canister support are not.

There is an excellent review of integrated canister stoves on BPL, the MSR Reactor came out on top for speed but the JB Sol Ti came out on top for efficiency and weight, and it was not that much slower than the Reactor.

It will be interesting how much more expensive the Sol Ti will be here in Australia when it is finally released for sale.

Tony

[photohiker]

Tony, it will be very expensive if history repeats. I bought my Sol ti from the US for less than I could buy a PCS locally.

Weights:

Basic system: 274g (Burner, ti pot, cosy, lid, orange cannister support gadget)

Plastic cup attaches to the bottom of the pot (for protection?) adds 33g

HTH

[etrangere]

Tony,

I agree the pot support, fuel stabiliser, cup, fuel cannister should be all the same across the Personal Cooking Systems. I have no experience in using the Jetboil products and boil times etc but gee test results calculated when bubbles appear at the bottom of the pot seems a bit rich!! lol I ended up choosing the Ti Sol model not only for the weight saving of the stove itself but hopefully it is a bit more economical on fuel too than the regular model

[Tony]

Tony, it will be very expensive if history repeats. I bought my Sol ti from the US for less than I could buy a PCS locally.

Weights:

Basic system: 274g (Burner, ti pot, cosy, lid, orange cannister support gadget)

Plastic cup attaches to the bottom of the pot (for protection?) adds 33g

HTH

Hi photohiker,

The standard Sol is US$120 RR, I have found it on the web for A$155.

It would not surprise me if the Sol Ti to be around A250- A$300.

Thanks for the plastic cup weight, I will have wait until tonight to weigh my PCS bits.

Tony