Help with PLB's =)

[mattmacman]

Hello all =) I have recently started doing solo and spontaneous small group walks. As a result I think a better safety net would be great.
I have looked at spot PLB's and satellite phones but have found flaws with both in the way of expensive registration, poor battery life and weight. As I recently have started working at a local Mountain Designs store I have noticed we now sell ACR ResQLink PLB's. At first I disliked them because there was no tracking from home feature and no programmable messages. However after reading a recent thread about the ACR I agree that a beacon should have one function and be able to execute that function at all times with no worry about battery life.
Im just curious with how others have dealt with this issue and if they have had any experience with the ACR.

[ninjapuppet]

As far as PLBs go, thats the cream of the crop at the moment. Cant go wrong there. If i buy another PLB, that would be the one I'd get.

In dealing with the lack of tracking or messages, I carry a Sat phone on multi-Day hikes too since I feel its superior in every aspect to a tracking system except bulk and weight.
- An sms costs me 50 cents, and I can get a recieved confirmation message if required for another 50 cents.
- In terms of weight, the rest of my gear is light, so I dont really notice this extra weight. Phone + battery + plastic case = 279g
- cost: I bought 27 minutes prepaid cards for $10 (special promotion) and this lasts me till May 2014, so I bought 10 of these prepaid cards. Normal price is $1 per minute.
- The phone is usually kept off, but its battery does have a 10 hour talk-time (incase I feel I need to talk to someone for that long)
- I can call in chopper / taxi / family member to pick me up at the end of a walk, rather than rely on a pre-arranged time for pick up and miss it.

On my last trip with a large group of people - near the end of the walk I ordered 8 pizzas and they were Just out of the oven as we finished our walk and reached the pizza bar. BLISS!

The sat phone kinda feels like its made my PLB redundant. However it has not!
I still carry my PLB because due to the fact its got a 7 year battery life guaranteed and waterproof, etc etc etc... It offers a higher percentage that it will work when you are in an emergency. That is all that matters. Everything else is just for convenience - my sat phone functions as a want, not a need. the PLB is more of a Need.

[mattmacman]

Hmmmm, maybe a sat phone is the way to go. What sort of sat phone do you use and recommend? Hopefully MD has a supplier I can get a discount with.

[ninjapuppet]

Hmmmm, maybe a sat phone is the way to go. What sort of sat phone do you use and recommend? Hopefully MD has a supplier I can get a discount with.

I really havnt done alot of reading to see whats out there so I cant make a good recommendation for you. I only got a isatphone Pro because my old one died and I found a good deal on it. seems to work well with no glitches so far - cant complain.
works just like a mobile phone, except you cant go walking around while you're talking.
I like the fact that its got a function where you can get your GPS location coordinates sent to you as an sms for free. You can then verify this with a map or send this coordinate to relatives to see where you are on google maps.
(........ or you can send it to rescuers if need be)

[mattmacman]

Sounds good. Ill look into it. Thanks for the help =)

[wildernesswanderer]

Wow MD has to be joking on the price, proves these types of stores inflate the price. A quick google search finds it $70 cheaper at a couple of marine stores..... What is it with hiking stores....

[wayno]

a fool and their money are easily parted?

[justacouch]

I agree that a beacon should have one function and be able to execute that function at all times with no worry about battery life.

While a PLB is probably more reliable than a spot messenger in a true distress situation, this is not due to the battery life of the Spot. If a Spot and a PLB are used in the same way - ie. turned on only in an emergency - then they both have excellent battery life. If you'd like to use the other messaging functions of the Spot, just take a spare set of 3 emergency only lithium AAAs and then, all else being equal, you're guaranteed to be able to send an SOS message. Spots can send 300 messages on one set of batteries, and operate tracking for 3.5days continuously (or 7 X 12 hour days). The difference is that PLBs have the advantage of government infrastructure, while Spot relies on a private company in Texas that has made mistakes before.

One advantage of a spot:
A PLB must be activated in order to send a distress signal, but a Spot with tracking enabled can signal distress without the user's intervention (other than turning it on in the morning). For example - on a difficult solo walk you might choose to turn tracking on before you leave. If you overshoot your return ETA your partner can check the SPOT tracking page and hopefully see that you're still making progress. Or perhaps you're off course and haven't moved for a couple of hours, in which case they can take the appropriate action (come looking for you etc).

I wrote a bit about spots recently, some of it is relevant to this discussion: http://rollick.com.au/2012/too-badass-for-spot-messaging/

[maddog]

Wow MD has to be joking on the price, proves these types of stores inflate the price. A quick google search finds it $70 cheaper at a couple of marine stores..... What is it with hiking stores....

Apparently, the high wages of retail staff and the GST are to blame.

[justacouch]

Wow MD has to be joking on the price, proves these types of stores inflate the price. A quick google search finds it $70 cheaper at a couple of marine stores..... What is it with hiking stores....

Just keep in mind that if you're an MD member you get 10% ($45) off, and if you're nice to the often underpaid retail staff they can sometimes help you out further.

[Ent]

Given that a marine shop is local store I would expect wage costs to be similar. I think we are seeing the rather well worn marketing approach of inflate price to discount. MD is generally not as bad as the other major single brand stores but it is still rather annoying practice.

Finding I am buying more and more gear from marine shops as the pricing is at least stable.

Cheers

[wayno]

i think the gear that doesnt tend to get shifted in large volumes doesnt attract the price cuts...
perhaps some bushwalker members should try to get some buying power together to get some bulk discount if theres enough demand?

[Ent]

Hi Wayno

Some considerable efforts were made a few years back to get a bulk buy but failed as no enthusiasm from the people selling them. At the time demand for mandatory boat use outstripped supply.

Now with the boating market filled prices should drop.

Cheers

[wayno]

i wonder how many more members there are now than a few years ago:?

[photohiker]

i wonder how many more members there are now than a few years ago:?

Hardly any, wayno.

Wasn't there a group buy organised through Campsaver recently?

[wayno]

oh yes, no one has joined recently at all...

memberlist.php?mode=&sk=c&sd=d#memberlist

[nq111]

I've looked at those SPOTs and think it is a bad idea in my case. They are widely noted to often miss signals getting through (due to terrain, weather, whatever).

No matter how much I explained it I am sure after a day of no signals received my wife would be calling in the choppers. I would rather not cause the stress.

The satellite phone option has been on the cards though. Already carry the PLB. Interesting to know you can get pre-paid type options - the service costs seem to be the killer with those things.

[justacouch]

I've looked at those SPOTs and think it is a bad idea in my case. They are widely noted to often miss signals getting through (due to terrain, weather, whatever).

No matter how much I explained it I am sure after a day of no signals received my wife would be calling in the choppers. I would rather not cause the stress.

The satellite phone option has been on the cards though. Already carry the PLB. Interesting to know you can get pre-paid type options - the service costs seem to be the killer with those things.

I hear you. Some people do have problems getting a signal with Spots (noted each year in the tour divide bike race for example). Spots use the less reliable globalstar satellite system which has a few black spots across the earth and doesn't seem to be as reliable as the iridium (sat phone) system. If you're moving though I think the Spot tracking would pick up a signal eventually, or at least provide your last known position (possibly in a situation where you were not able to activate a PLB - good for solo walkers).

It's worth considering that, depending on the individual situation, a partner could also send a search party due to an overshot ETA, and with a PLB there is no way to signal that everything is OK.

However, as you suggest, an iridium satellite phone and PLB covers all bases, but comes at a significant cost and weight. These are personal choices that need to be made based on the capabilities offered by each system versus the likely need and cost. A Spot is a compromise between the two.

Of course all of this talk of emergency beacons is on the caveat that the priority should always be not getting in trouble in the first place and, if trouble does occur, being prepared to self rescue.

[andrewp]

I too prefer carrying a PLB. They are specifically designed as emergency devices. SPOT is not very useful if you can't get a GPS fix, whereas a PLB will still give a location within 2km.

Regarding the objection that you cannot send a 'I'm OK' message, I believe that this is being incorporated into the standards. It may occur an additional service cost though.

I always tell my emergency contact that 'no news is good news'. I.e. if you're late and haven't activated the PLB, then the chances are that the party is OK, but delayed. Of course there's always the possibility that the guy carrying the PLB fell over a cliff .

[photohiker]

Also consider that newer satellite trackers are available that use the iridium network and have two way text messaging. Of course, they cost more than the spot...

[mattmacman]

I think that the 'no news is good news' principle is a good one. Although I do like the ability to talk to you're rescuers about your location, how bad your situation is and how you can help them help you etc.
Maybe I can discuss a group purchase with my manager at work?

[Amanda]

On price, the best price I could find it on line was about $380 but also about $15 postage. Which means MD are selling it for only about $10 more than the cheapest online price I could find, $405 after member discount. Which IMHO is pretty good for a bricks and mortar store.

[Wolfix]

Ah more retail staff bashing. FYI I am on award wage. If you have a problem with people earning a living wage, there are plenty of countries that don't pay it, including USA where the gear is also cheaper. Go figure!

But +1 what Amanda said. $405 for the ResQLink is a good price and you have someone to physically *&%$#! to if there is ever a problem!

[ninjapuppet]

Car insurance is always expensive .... Until your car is totalled and written off.

In that situation, I wouldn't really care if I had paid for a $2000/yr policy or an $1800/yr policy as long as it's covered.

[wayno]

nz we're looking at over $600 best price...

[tsangpo]

Car insurance is always expensive .... Until your car is totalled and written off.

In that situation, I wouldn't really care if I had paid for a $2000/yr policy or an $1800/yr policy as long as it's covered.

Not for me when the car is worth ~$3500 and insurance is over a grand a year, ~$250 for 3rd party is much more reasonable.

Any way I'm not sure if I got this link from another thread on here or found it googling but http://www.chsmith.com.au/Products/ACR- ... s-PLB.html $370 in Melbourne with a free first aid kit, strobe light and signalling mirror. Plus if you add a few items to get it up to $400 it's free shipping in Australia

[Wolfix]

That free stuff was a gift with purchase from ACR but the offer is finished. I doubt you'd still be able to get it. The retailers didn't have the stock to give out so I can't see how they'd be offering it. Also check postage. As Amanda said, may be close to what you pay at MD.

[mattmacman]

Spoke to the manager at work.
The ACR ResQLink is $449.95, (the buoyant and non buoyant model), if a couple of people were interested we can get 20% off that ($359.95) and if we can get around 5, or more, we can see about further discounts. The store I work in is in WA so eastern states members may have to pay postage or I can see about transferring them across stores. The beacons will be sold through mountain designs so you will receive a receipt with valid warranty exactly as if you had purchased it yourself =)

In reply to the person who's name I don't recall that was questioning retail wage. I know I'm still a student and I get paid fairly and I can say that for my older colleagues. People need to make a living.

[maddog]

In reply to the person who's name I don't recall that was questioning retail wage...People need to make a living.

I assume you, and Wolfix, are referring to this:

Apparently, the high wages of retail staff and the GST are to blame.

Spot the oxymoron?

Cheers

[mattmacman]

Hey guys sorry if anyone was interested in the PLB's, the information I received about the discount was incorrect and I have to withdrawal the offer Sorry if anyone was dissapointed.


EDIT by moderator. At the request of the OP, this topic has been locked.