Cold Feet

[Alpinetreka]

Hi all,

I do quite a lot of treking/camping in the NSW alpine region IVO Mt Kosciuszko and Mt Townsend. Despite the extreme cold of winter in these locations, I am usually sufficiently warm on overnight outings and sleeping in snow caves etc - with one exception. My feet.

On my last outing I wore non-Gortex, full leather boots (Zamberlans) which had been treated with snoseal. Whilst they proved to be completely water resistant, I found that as soon as I stopped snow shoeing, or was idle in our snow cave, my feet were painfully cold.

Does anyone have any suggestions apart from buying dedicated snow boots? Perhaps over boots, insulated liners, or another means to modify my existing boots. Does anyone have any experience here?

Many thanks in advance for any advice, Aaron

[gayet]

I can't comment on different boots, and I don't go in for snow caves, but try something else once stopped for the day. - not sure how down booties (water resistant outers and soft, flexible, sole that is also somewhat rock proof ) would do but I think they would be fine in a snow cave. Also just take the outer off and you have nice warm feet to slide into s/bag with. They are very light and pack down to very little. See Feathered Friends (http://featheredfriends.com/sleeping-bags/accessories/down-booties.html - I can recommend them for cold camps, albeit not snow caves.

A pair of thick wool socks may provide better insulation in the boot for stoppages. Leather will transmit the cold very easily, and wool may reduce its transfer to your feet.

[roysta]

See Feathered Friends (http://featheredfriends.com/sleeping-bags/accessories/down-booties.html - I can recommend them for cold camps, albeit not snow caves.

I have the down booties mentioned above, but I also have other ones, which I rate higher, and they're cheaper.
http://www.wildthingsgear.com/high-loft ... -1861.html
Try your thickest socks in them and you may get some joy.

[Moondog55]

Are your boots sized big enough to allow the wearing of 2 pair of socks and still have wriggle room in the toes?
I have exactly the same problem since my feet stretched and I am still saving for new boots. Otherwise when you stop immediately change into clean dry socks and lightweight camp footwear

[photohiker]

Also, conserve body heat, especially in the legs. Don an insulative layer as soon as you stop. When I get cold feet, they can stay for hours and I find a good protection is to reduce the heat loss from calves and thighs. If your legs are warm, your feet will warm faster.

If the conditions are cold, it can be useful to hop in your sleeping bag as soon as the tent is up to conserve heat. Depending on gear choices, it can be possible to sit in the sleeping bag and cook a brew. Not much more warming than that!

[Spartan]

Hi, Aaron.

Apart from/in concert with investing in decent winter socks, there are a few things that might work for you. First, a thin vapour barrier sock (I use 'SealSkinz', myself) worn over your normal socks can help to keep the toes 'toasty'. Second, invest in decent innersoles for your boots. And a third, end-of-day option is to wear a pair of neoprene booties over your socks when you stop snowshoeing and 'bivvy-up'. All three approaches helped to make me much more comfortable a few years back, when suffering through a Mountain Warfare course conducted in the Victorian/NSW Alps.

All the best.

[Joomy]

These would help at camp: https://goosefeetgear.com/products Practically weightless.

[madmacca]

I agree with Photohiker - rather than looking at socks, boots, etc just to make your feet warm, focus on warming the rest of your body.

The main way your body conserves heat is to constrict blood flow away from the limbs and extremities, and towards the torso and head. It doesn't matter how well insulated your feet are, if the rest of the body is cold, your body will constrict the blood flow, and you will end up with cold feet.

While you are walking along, your body is generating heat, plus the legs are demanding oxygen, and blood is flowing to them to supply it. Once you stop, that heat is no longer being generated, and your body will start to conserve heat. The way to address this is to put more clothing on the rest of your body.

[Moondog55]

With all due respect to Photohiker and Madmacca my experience is the opposite.
It sounds to me as if you are using a good heavy duty summer boot for winter work, one solution is to use a good overboot such as the Berghaus "Supergaiter" or canvas "Footbags" such as the old Millet and it just happens that Paddy Pallin has a few Supergaiters left at a good price

[wayno]

make sure you've got a decent warm hat on first before you look at recladding your feet..., make sure you keep the draught out of your neck, good fitting collars or a buff or scarf. you just haemorage heat from those areas if they arent insulated properly and that contributes to cold feet.

[Moondog55]

Pardon the "Cut&paste" but it is the easiest way to do this

My Feet Get Cold First

One of the most difficult parts of your body to keep warm is your feet. That’s because they’re the farthest, physically, from your body’s warm core. Here are some tips for keeping your feet as warm and comfortable as possible.
Make sure your boots fit properly
· Select a style of boot suited to the activity you’ll be using it for (Example – hunting, hiking, etc.)
· Try on several boots with the appropriate sock system until you’re sure of a good fit
Sizing
· When trying on cold weather boots, start with a half-size larger than your street shoes
· Try the boots on with the sock system you’re planning to wear
· Slide your foot all the way forward into the boot, you should be able to slide one finger behind your heel
· Change sizes if necessary until it’s right
· Move your foot into a comfortable position and close the boot
· It should be snug without pressure points but still have plenty of wiggle room for your toes
· Walk around (including uphill and downhill) until you’re comfortable
· Your heel should not move more than a half-inch, nor should your toes touch the front of the boot
Socks
· Generally, two pairs of socks are the best bet:
o A thin liner sock that’s wickable, like polypropylene
o A thick outer sock of wool
· The sock system should not overcrowd the boot, making it too constricted for good circulation
Start with warm, dry feet and footwear
· Keep your socks and boots inside your car (not the trunk) on the way to your destination
· If your feet sweat, put on fresh, dry socks just before going out, or anytime after a period of activity prior to resting


Keep your feet dry
· Consider purchasing waterproof boots
· Use foot powder or anti-perspirant on your feet
· Use waterproof, breathable socks or boot liners
Keep your body warm and your metabolism high
· Your body core and head must be kept warm to allow for circulation to other body parts
· If either your body core or head are too cold, your body will shut down the heating of extremities in order to keep the core and head warm, causing your feet and hands to get cold
· Eating calorie-rich foods and drinking lots of liquids will keep your body energized
· Chemicals in caffeine and nicotine will have the opposite effect

[photohiker]

I guess this begs the question back to Alpinetreka: Do your feet get cold while snow shoeing or after you stop?

If you're getting cold feet while snow shoeing I agree with Moondog55 100%

[Alpinetreka]

Many thanks to all for their informative tips and advice. Much appreciated indeed.

I will definitely incorporate much of it into my next outing in August (snowcaving around Kosciuszko) and post results.

I look forward to not wondering if my toes are still there as I sip my mulled wine this time!

Aaron

[wayno]

if its still a problem, consider changing footwear to warmer boots made more for colder mountain conditions...