YAEL (Yet another Equipment List)

[Flipper Hands]

MOVED FROM Essential Equipment Stickie

Hi all,

Long time lurker, experienced day walker and car camper, moving up into multi-day walks.
Thought it was time to post I would appreciate any input on my preparation.

I'm heading off to the Warrumbungles NP for a multiday, bit of a trial run for new gear, with a view to Larapinta mid year.
* 45+ yo
* Average fitness (I can run a 5k in slow time, knees permitting with no cardio issues)
* 105kg
* 6’ 3”
* Solo
* 3 days
* 2 nights
* 35C heat
* Water at both camp sites

Pack 2.7kg

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2350g     Osprey Aether 70 XL (76L)
75g       Nivia Moisturiser Sunscreen (in hip pocket)
142g      Leatherman Skeletool  (in hip pocket)
130g      Sea to Summit Ultra-Light Packcover - Large  (in hip pocket)

2697g

Shelter 1.5kg

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1540g      MSR Hubba Hubba NX 2P Tent

1540g

Water 1kg (water is priority)

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299g       MSR Autoflow
199g       MSR 4L Dromlite
55g        MSR Hydration Kit
179g       Nalgene Wide Mouth Loop-Top bottle
221g       LifeStraw Go Filter Bottle

953g

Sleep 1kg (no bag)

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000g       Globetrotter Semi-Rectangular Down Sleeping Bag v6 - Shadow/Silver/Salsa - Large
660g       Thermarest Prolite L
190g       eBay Vietnam Silk Sleeping Bag Liner
114g       Sea to Summit Aeros Premium Pillow

964g

Cook 0.6kg

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470g      Stove (lighter, matches, sponge, etc, stove, pots etc.)
45g       Utensils
65g       Sea to Summit Collapsible Mug

580g

Electrical 1.4kg

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220g       Samsung Note 3
365g       Suaoki 16W/20W Solar Panel
90g        Petzel Headlamp
320g       Xiaomi 16000mah (320g)
338g       Charging Cables
           eBay Samsung Note 3 4250mah battery case
           Sony FM/AM Walkman SRF-59
           Apple iPod nano 5G 16GB A1320
           Other

1433g

Navigation & Communication 0kg
See electrical

Personal & Medical 0.7kg

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720g      Medication, Hikers wool, other blister stuff (been having boot trouble)
???g       Snake Bite Kit

Base Pack Weight 9kg

Food ~2KG + fuel

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375g      Fuel
375g      Fuel (partially empty)

Clothing 3.6kg

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1800g        Keen Boots + Icebreaker Socks (heavy with lots of Dubbin and orthodics)
100g         Legionnaire Cap
660g         Kathmandu Convertible Cargo Pants + Leather Belt
670g         Polyester T-Shirt
             Kathmandu Thermal Pants
             Patagonia Long Sleeve Base Layer
             Jocks
             Speedos
330g         Microfibre Towel
             Gaiters

3560g

[Flipper Hands]

You're taking a solar panel but not a sleeping bag?

1. Panel is a new toy, so trying it out in the wild.
2. 16C overnight, and I sleep hot.
3. I have a bag liner.
4. I have light base layers for sleeping if cold.

[Flipper Hands]

This is the 'what gear is essential' thread:

essential
ɪˈsɛnʃ(ə)l/
adjective
adjective: essential

1.
absolutely necessary; extremely important.
"it is essential to keep up-to-date records"
synonyms: crucial, necessary, key, vital, indispensable, needed, required, called for, requisite, important, all-important, vitally important, of the utmost importance, of great consequence, of the essence, critical, life-and-death, imperative, mandatory, compulsory, obligatory, compelling, urgent, pressing, burning, acute, paramount, pre-eminent, high-priority, significant, consequential
"it is essential to remove all the old plaster"

Consider me embarrassed.

[Flipper Hands]

Thanks so much for the input!!

Personal/ First Aid needs some work.

Medical and Personal needs to be expanded to answer this. I already have;

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Hikers Wool
30ml Hand Sanitiser
15ml Iodine
Toothbrush
15ml Toothpaste
15ml Heel Balm
Nail Clippers
Scissors (micro)
Tweezers
Oral Thermometer
String (5m)
Superglue
Paracetomol
Ibuprofen (to be switched for Asprin)
Cotton Balls
Cotton Buds
TP
Band-aids
Tape
Insect Repellent
Sunscreen
Snakebite kit
Wipies


Include- A space blanket... you know, just in case. And well, if you are even contemplating not taking a sleeping bag you may just need it!

This seems like solid advice, I'll look at adding one.

Also, a triangular bandage (multitude of uses for first aid), some crepe bandages, tape, scissors, tape, bushmans/ airogaurd, hydration tablets, some water purification tabs as a back up to your straw (which you may get rather frustrated with, kind of like drinking heavy ice cream through a straw at McD's!). You will need some band aids, and some gauze, disposable gloves, and possibly some antiseptic creme and some alcohol wipes (can be used to help start a fire if you need in an emergency as well as the usual), Panadol, aspirin (aspirin can be used in first aid to help anyone with a suspected heart attack, and well, you are in that age category, take some.) String can be handy too.

First aid gear is a priority not an after thought.

You haven't included toothpaste, toothbrush, comb, hand sanitizer. All of this is not essential I guess, but I take it.

I think I have all that covered now.

I don't know why you have all that water collecting kit. Personally I wouldn't bother with having more than one filter, if that. [/quote]
I'll re-add some purification tablets and drop the Life Straw back to day walk backup

Just my opinion.

Again - thanks for the thought

[Flipper Hands]

I don't know why you have all that water collecting kit. Personally I wouldn't bother with having more than one filter, if that.

Just my opinion.

hmm... what I see is one water filter. With a back up lifestraw incase of water filter failure, which is 40g heavier than the Nalgene. 40g hardly seems excessive. In hot weather 6 litres of carry capacity seems appropriate too.

Alittleruff"was correct - I was overdoing it, especially for this walk.

[Flipper Hands]

Agreed, 40g of water filter seems fine to me. But then I've never used water filters.
So I was wondering why would you have 1. A filter in your drink bottle (40g). Then 2. A larger (299g) Filter for collecting water. Then a 4L bag that weighs in at 199g + tubing for it at 55g. Seems like a lot to me. But I'm only new to this stuff, and generally just carry a 2L bladder and a few larger water bottles and some Aqua Pure tabs. I could go lighter & better by using an old cask wine bladder. But... I have to drink the wine first, and I'm not much of a drinker.

Is the area that Flipper Hands is travelling into particularly hard to find clean water in? Looking at the web site, drinking water is available at Burbie Camp, Camp Pincham & Camp Walaay by the looks, but maybe he is headed a bit more remote?

All good questions In an earlier reply, I will drop the Life Straw to day walk backup. I use the MSR Dromlite as my main water system, with the MSR Hydration Kit (tube). So in camp I will break out the MSR Autoflow (if required) for another 4l of storage with filtering capability at the cost of 300g. I think it s a decent compromise.

The Nalgene Bottle will be empty most of the time. I'll use it around camp and take it on side walks. I have seen a number of people talk about using a wine cask bladder for water storage, which is fine round camp, I'd imagine they'd puncture easily if used walking though. (?)

I'm staying at Burbie Camp (spring, almost certainly fine unfiltered) and Balor Hut (tank, which should be fine)

I've not camped or walked at these spots before, so above are only assumptions on water quality, think its worth the risk of not taking a filter? As I said before - I will have purification tablets to fall back on.

And only my mum calls me Flipper Hands Flipper is just fine.

[Flipper Hands]

Also, a friend of me has loaned me a PLB and a Spot Tracker for the walk.

I'll definitely buy a PLB (next purchase). I'm debating about the spot tracker.

[Gadgetgeek]

filter your water just to be safe, but that said, if you need water, drink it. you'll be out before you'll get sick, and you'll have time to get meds into you before the parasites take hold. Wine casks as water storeage works if you have a good packing system and are very careful. The guys I work with often use them on canoe and kayak trips as they pack in barrels. 35 degrees can really pull the electrolytes out, so make sure you have some replacement. I don't want to make assumptions, but guys your size and age tend to be on fairly low sodium diets. I've found that day two can really suck if you run low. Its not just sodium, potassium and calcium are important too.

Carry the spot this time, see if you like it.

Personally I would get ruthless on the little first aid stuff. if you need to do solo first aid, its either going to be big stuff, or little annoying things (or blisters) the annoying stuff needs just enough to keep from bleeding on your gear, you can do the cleaning and infection control when you get home on a three dayer. There is a lot of just fluff there. thermometer? no need, if you are feeling too crook to walk, you will be hitting the SOS button, you won't be trying to self-diagnose. you won't have food to wait out a fever. Thats the kind of thing I'm talking about. But non-stick dressings and large gauze can be the difference between bleeding out and getting out. I'll take big gauze over almost anything else any day. I've patched some big wounds with just a non-stick and tape.

the AMK heat-sheets are the best. And its worth haveing one for cases of shock, hypothermia and the like. I don't see rain gear, which is not always needed. But spending a night cold and wet can really deplete a body, and can put someone in a bad situation. So a good large space blanket can become that shelter if needed until the tent is up, and then can help you warm up and dry out.

I'd try to trim out the stove kit, and see if you can shed a bit there.

Ultimately you walk your own walk, and you'll find things that you need to adjust/change. But I think you've got a fairly solid basis there. I think its a good start as far as not trying to conquer the world in the first hit.

[Strider]

What does the snake bit kit consist? Are you familiar with the recommended pressure-immobilisation treatment for Australian snakes?

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[Flipper Hands]

filter your water just to be safe, but that said, if you need water, drink it. you'll be out before you'll get sick, and you'll have time to get meds into you before the parasites take hold. Wine casks as water storeage works if you have a good packing system and are very careful. The guys I work with often use them on canoe and kayak trips as they pack in barrels. 35 degrees can really pull the electrolytes out, so make sure you have some replacement. I don't want to make assumptions, but guys your size and age tend to be on fairly low sodium diets. I've found that day two can really suck if you run low. Its not just sodium, potassium and calcium are important too.

TBH I would prefer to not get sick, but absolutely, I'd drink my own pee before I died of thirst. So a muddy waterhole would be a no brainer as a "(second) last resort. I should be right on electrolytes, I take a barrage of vitamin supplements (including calcium) along as well. Also have plenty of salty trailmix to keep the sodium up. As for inferring things from my age, go for it. I have my problems, but generally I'm in pretty decent health, dont drink or smoke and get my 30min minimum of cardio every day (I'm just carrying about 10kg too much, sadly, I eat like a Labrador).

Carry the spot this time, see if you like it.

And so I shall. I like the idea of Mrs Flipper Hands being able to see where I am and when I have settled down for the night, and so does she. The new ones add text capability as well, which is also nice.

Personally I would get ruthless on the little first aid stuff. if you need to do solo first aid, its either going to be big stuff, or little annoying things (or blisters) the annoying stuff needs just enough to keep from bleeding on your gear, you can do the cleaning and infection control when you get home on a three dayer. There is a lot of just fluff there. thermometer? no need, if you are feeling too crook to walk, you will be hitting the SOS button, you won't be trying to self-diagnose. you won't have food to wait out a fever. Thats the kind of thing I'm talking about. But non-stick dressings and large gauze can be the difference between bleeding out and getting out. I'll take big gauze over almost anything else any day. I've patched some big wounds with just a non-stick and tape.

When I put the first aid kit together i just hoovered up all the best suggestions. I've already culled it a bit via consolidation (if you can believe that). The intent was to put a kit together for a much longer walk (Larapinta). For things like for example the thermometer, would you take those along on a longer walk?

I'll add some gauze and non stick dressing to the kit - I have tape, and the http://www.paddypallin.com.au/equip-snake-bite-kit.html has triangular bandage. Will that do the trick?

the AMK heat-sheets are the best. And its worth haveing one for cases of shock, hypothermia and the like. I don't see rain gear, which is not always needed. But spending a night cold and wet can really deplete a body, and can put someone in a bad situation. So a good large space blanket can become that shelter if needed until the tent is up, and then can help you warm up and dry out.

I'll see what I can find tomorrow as far as heat sheets go, I walk past all trekking/mountaineering places in Sydney CBD at least twice a day. If I cant find an AMK I will invest in a cheapy. Rain wise I'll be taking a North Face Venture shell with me up to Connabarabran, I'll make a call as to taking it based on the weather forecasts when I leave for the walk.

I'd try to trim out the stove kit, and see if you can shed a bit there.

Suggestions?, I think I am down to the bone here, unless I cull one of the pots (500ml and 1l)

Ultimately you walk your own walk, and you'll find things that you need to adjust/change. But I think you've got a fairly solid basis there. I think its a good start as far as not trying to conquer the world in the first hit.

Thanks very much I know my limitations, i have done enough 30km days in the RNP to know my limits. This trip is deliberately paced much slower, because of the increased weight, and the heat

Besides, (paraphrasing) it's all about the journey, not the destination.

[Flipper Hands]

What does the snake bit kit consist? Are you familiar with the recommended pressure-immobilisation treatment for Australian snakes?

http://www.paddypallin.com.au/equip-snake-bite-kit.html

Truthfully, no. I have skimmed some of the threads here, as far as I can tell the #1 thing you should do is immobilise yourself. There seems to be some debate as to the validity of applying pressure via heavy bandages (which is what I was taught as a lad on the farm). My approach for this trip will be immobilse, and call 000 for help, then follow verbal instructions. Failing 000 contact then I will hit the PLB, try to stay calm, and follow the instructions in the kit.

I've already verified that there is good 3G/4G coverage in the park. I'm far from counting on that though.

Solid enough plan?

[Strider]

Yep makes sense. The kits appears to be just an elasticated bandage or two.

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[Strider]

720g is a huge first aid kit. Are you able to break it down for us?

Realistically, any serious injuries will be a PLB activation. Other than a few meds, Band-Aids, bandages and other comfort items, what more do you really need?

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[Flipper Hands]

Absolutely. Though its not just 1st aid.

Trauma/First Aid 220g

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Equip Snake Bite Kit - 150g
Tweezers 10g
Cotton buds and balls - 10g
Asprin - 10g
Iodine - 20g
Paracetamol - 20g
Gauze-??g
Non Adhesive Pads - ??g

Meds 110g

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Ventolin - 40g (Asthma) (DITCHED)
Symbiocort - 40g  (Asthma)
Various Med's and Multivitamins - 30g (Think of this as food ;))
Gaviscon tablets - 30g (DITCHED)
Iberogast - 120g (!!!in glass bottle, too heavy, will sort this out fast and get it in a 15/30ml bottle) assume 40g

Blisters 205g

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Hikers Wool (half empty) - 40g
Roll of adhesive gauze tape 50g
Scissors - 20g
Gel Blister packs -50g
Assortment of Band-Aids - 25g (probably too many)
Heal balm - 20g

Personal/Hygiene 25g

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Hand Sanitiser - 45g (DITCHED)
Wipies - 30g (DITCHED)
Toothbrush - 5g (removed handle)
Toothpaste - 20g

Other 45g

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Patellar Knee Strap (Grade #2 Patellar Tendonitis) /cheer - 30g
Cord - 10g
Superglue - 5g

After culling, I am down to 610g for all the above, a couple <20g items to add guaze etc.

[Sandbars]

Meds 110g

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Ventolin - 40g (Asthma) (DITCHED)
Symbiocort - 40g  (Asthma)
Various Med's and Multivitamins - 30g (Think of this as food ;))
Gaviscon tablets - 30g (DITCHED)
Iberogast - 120g (!!!in glass bottle, too heavy, will sort this out fast and get it in a 15/30ml bottle) assume 40g

I would think two and three times before ditching the ventolin. Even if you very rarely use it - when you bushwalk, you go to places that are away from your usual, and there will be different plants and other allergens there, that you may react to. I have seen very stable asthmatics have bad attacks when walking. Plus, its not something that you can improvise. You can always use some item of clothing as a sling, or to stop bleeding etc, but if you cannot breathe.... A PBL is not like ringing an ambulance, you have to be prepared to take care of yourself for up to 24 hours, depending on location, before you get assistance. Far more people die each year from asthma attacks than snake bites, and yet people are consistently happier to carry 150g snakebite kit than 40g ventolin.

When I am putting together a first aid kit, I ask these questions:

*what will this be used for?
*how likely is that to happen?
*is there anything else that can be used to substitute?
*what is the worst thing that can happen if I do not have this?

for example:

triangle bandage

used for sling, to wrap severe bleeds, to use as a tie for a splint. severe events - unlikely to happen. Can use shirt for sling, any long sleeve item to wrap bleeds or use a tie for a splint. Worst thing that might happen: imperfect sling (uncomfortable but not life threatening), lose an item of clothing as a bandage.

ventolin:

used as bronchodilator, severe asthma attack, fairly uncommon. No useful substitute. Potentially life-threatening if you don't have it.

[Flipper Hands]

Meds 110g

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Ventolin - 40g (Asthma) (DITCHED)
Symbiocort - 40g  (Asthma)
Various Med's and Multivitamins - 30g (Think of this as food ;))
Gaviscon tablets - 30g (DITCHED)
Iberogast - 120g (!!!in glass bottle, too heavy, will sort this out fast and get it in a 15/30ml bottle) assume 40g

I would think two and three times before ditching the ventolin. Even if you very rarely use it - when you bushwalk, you go to places that are away from your usual, and there will be different plants and other allergens there, that you may react to. I have seen very stable asthmatics have bad attacks when walking. Plus, its not something that you can improvise. You can always use some item of clothing as a sling, or to stop bleeding etc, but if you cannot breathe.... A PBL is not like ringing an ambulance, you have to be prepared to take care of yourself for up to 24 hours, depending on location, before you get assistance. Far more people die each year from asthma attacks than snake bites, and yet people are consistently happier to carry 150g snakebite kit than 40g ventolin.

When I am putting together a first aid kit, I ask these questions:

*what will this be used for?
*how likely is that to happen?
*is there anything else that can be used to substitute?
*what is the worst thing that can happen if I do not have this?

for example:

triangle bandage

used for sling, to wrap severe bleeds, to use as a tie for a splint. severe events - unlikely to happen. Can use shirt for sling, any long sleeve item to wrap bleeds or use a tie for a splint. Worst thing that might happen: imperfect sling (uncomfortable but not life threatening), lose an item of clothing as a bandage.

ventolin:

used as bronchodilator, severe asthma attack, fairly uncommon. No useful substitute. Potentially life-threatening if you don't have it.

Symbiocort (in the above list) is my asthma preventative. I get relief from using the preventative very quickly.

I can go for days without preventative with no issue.

This was the reason I culled it when pressed to reduce weight.

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[wayno]

i'd change the leather belt for a synthetic one. lighter and holds a lot less moisture...

[Gadgetgeek]

for pots, depends on how you cook, I get away with an 800ml pot with a fry-pan lid. (snow-peak trek 800) But you will know after you do the walk how much you can trim out.

[Flipper Hands]

i'd change the leather belt for a synthetic one. lighter and holds a lot less moisture...

I'll look into that, thanks. It did occur to me that having a solid leather belt might serve a number of useful purposes that I cannot forsee.

[Flipper Hands]

for pots, depends on how you cook, I get away with an 800ml pot with a fry-pan lid. (snow-peak trek 800) But you will know after you do the walk how much you can trim out.

I've used this set-up on a couple overnighters. I could probably cull back to a single 1l pot if pressed. Just means I dont have a convenient brew size pot. Regular cups of tea is one of the most essential parts of camping for me, and something I'd like to be a bigger part of my walking.

Ill pay close attention to the process.

[Gadgetgeek]

I get that, its why I lashed out on a titanium set! Honestly, I think you have a pretty good setup. Its a grams game from here on out, and only you know where you can shave things off, and where you can't.

[Flipper Hands]

I get that, its why I lashed out on a titanium set! Honestly, I think you have a pretty good setup. Its a grams game from here on out, and only you know where you can shave things off, and where you can't.

Ta. Thanks all for the advice and time.

Just had the pack on - without water. The weight feels fine. We shall see how we are going at 1600 Tuesday

Also, big thanks to all the others on the forum that have taken the time and effort to respond, it is greatly appreciated.

[cjhfield]

A late response. Symbicort is a reliever and preventer combined - it contains a 12 hour ventolin and works almost as fast as straight ventolin. It is considered reasonable to use it a a single puffer i.e. use it regularly as a preventer and acutely to fix an attack. So Ventolin not essential.

Chris