PLB and NSW Police

[Ent]

Hi

Yesterday I sort of half watched a report on ABC2 about a rescue in a canyon in NSW I think and that charges would/could be laid against the three people involved. The Police were very damming of them and also appeared to suggest that people venturing outside without a PLB were a menace to the community and are endangering Police Officers. Did I "miss see" the report or are the NSW Police getting heavy and have launched a yet unofficial campaign to have PLB compulsory equipment for anyone venturing into a national park?

Cheers Brett

[Macca81]

link to story?

[Ent]

Just caught it on ABC but I will attempt to track it down. I assume I was awake and not dreaming but it was in the morning

Arh found it, so I was not dreaming

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/na ... 53396.aspx

Cheers Brett

PS Bit curious on what are "appropriate" preparations as if the wheels fall off then Ipso Facto they were inadequate Looks like bush-walkers are the new lepers, at least in NSW. No doubt we will have arm chair experts recommending a never ending series of requirements.

[Son of a Beach]

also here: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010 ... 822658.htm
(with a link to an ABC news video story as well).

The video report linked to from the page above talks about one woman being easy to find, because she had a PLB, and then immediately afterwards says that police are cracking down on those who break the rules.

It sounds at first as though they're talking about people who are not carrying PLBs, but it then goes on to talk about people who enter tracks and areas that are clearly closed with signs all over them saying so. So hopefully it's not the lack of PLBs that they're talking about, but just the walking into closed tracks/areas.

PS. I notice in the article Brett linked to it says, "Blue Mountains police said they were sick of rescuing bushwalkers and canyoners who did not take the proper precautions."

[1iron]

I think the NSW police certainly in the Blue mountains provide PLBs to people going bush etc which may be why they are damming people who go without.

[Jellybean]

I quickly read the story about the 3 canyoners in the SMH on-line yesterday. My understanding (from my skim read) was that the main gripe with the 3 canyoners (and the reason charges were either being considered or laid) was that they had deliberately ignored locked gates and signs advising that the canyon was closed due to dangerous conditions caused by our recent 400mm of rain. You can't really blame the police for getting sick of such gross stupidity.

[DaveNoble]

Its my understanding that the canyon was closed not because of high water levels - but rather because of construction work (The tourist track into the canyon is being rebuilt). The closure of the area has been well advertised and there were clear signs and barriers in place (but not locked gates). The main danger necessitating the closure was due to helicopters lowering in supplies at various times. This would have been unlikely in bad weather. Also - the three people involved did not need rescuing - they were overdue and on there way out when met by a rescue party heading in.

Dave

[Jellybean]

This was the article I read, but there were a few others with slightly varying stories (it is the media )

http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-new ... -o9bx.html

[Ent]

Hi

So yet again we are left with conflicting stories I do get the sense though at least in NSW police are starting to vilify walkers unless they meet standards that the Police want. Hands up those that have stepped over a close track sign Safety is important but I do feel that the nanny state is moving into high gear at least in NSW. Heck, I am no UL walker but I would not like to see bureaucratic interference into someone skilled in making equipment choices. As for PLBs, yes they are a great idea but as with the rock fall tragedy the media are giving them almost mythical powers. We have witness in Tassie the strangest fire restrictions code that can cause someone to suffer criminal sanctions so goodness knows what some bureaucrat could have in store for the us and our passion. Now my opinion could be the result of indifferent media reporting but something tells me that future events will receive unjustified comments from the media and by the looks of it the NSW Police.

Regards Brett

[Jellybean]

'Having witnessed first hand the amount of garbage that is written in the media (compared to the actual facts of a case)(I have worked in high performance - "elite" - sport in a range of roles for over 20 years), I think it is really important not to base your opinions solely on what you read in the media. There is a reason why newspaper articles are called "stories" (they are often more fiction than fact).

Unfortunately, that's all most people have to go on (unless you've been in a situation where you've seen the gross discrepancies between what's written in the media and reality, you don't know any better). I've learnt to take most stories with a grain of salt (although sometimes I still get sucked in).

In this case what you are reading is the media's interpretation and reporting of the police reaction, not the actual police reaction.

It's always worth remembering that the ultimate goal of the media source is to sell more papers, score more hits, etc., not necessarily to tell the truth. Often times they don't know the truth or their "story" is alot more tantalising than the actual truth.

Sad but true.

[Macca81]

for the offence of engaging in an activity in a national park that causes risk to safety.

i drove from the entrance of the park to the visitor centre carpark. in this time i was engaging in an activity that was causing a risk to my safety as i may have lost control of the vehicle and slammed into a tree and had a limb fall on the roof of the car causing me to me trapped within the vehicle and needing the emergency services to be called...


sounds like exactly what jellybean says, the media translating the story in a manner which makes for better reading.

[tastrax]

Also - the three people involved did not need rescuing - they were overdue .......

To me this should be the starting point of the questioning..... - how overdue, who had they told about their plans, what backup did they have, who "set off" the "rescue" plan that they left behind?

[Taurë-rana]

We saw this Nanny state attitude in a few places on the mainland around Aus 20 years ago - it particularly struck us at Murray Falls I think it was in Qld where there were fences to stop people going to the base of the waterfall because people had jumped off and wrecked their backs. I think it got like that because of the ridiculous compensation claims that were going on at the time.

It's apparent that Tassie authorities don't take the idea of carrying PLBs as seriously as NSW - I found this quote from the article interesting:
"Emergency personal locator beacons are available in the Blue Mountains seven days a week from the Echo Point and Glenbrook visitor information centres and the NPWS Heritage Centre at Blackheath during business hours, as well as at Springwood and Katoomba police stations.

PLB's are available for hire in Tassie only at Hobart, Burnie, Devonport and Launceston Service Tas shops - so only in office hours and if they don't happen to be all hired out, and I think they have them at Cradle too. I was astounded that Mt Field visitor centre doesn't have them for hire being a gateway to the SW, far more necessary down there than on the OT I would think and open 7 days a week.

[under10kg]

All the PLBs were hired out in hobart last week.

[johnw]

It's apparent that Tassie authorities don't take the idea of carrying PLBs as seriously as NSW - I found this quote from the article interesting:
"Emergency personal locator beacons are available in the Blue Mountains seven days a week from the Echo Point and Glenbrook visitor information centres and the NPWS Heritage Centre at Blackheath during business hours, as well as at Springwood and Katoomba police stations

I think this is a great incentive, but probably should point out that it appears that they only have 20 of them, assuming this is correct:
http://bushwalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1709&hilit=+plb&p=36928#p36928
If everyone bushwalking or canyoning in the Blue Mtns at any one time (that's a lot of people) suddenly wanted to borrow one it would create a demand exceeding supply problem.

Re the Grand Canyon incident, as Dave Noble pointed out the tourist track through it is closed for 6 months or so. I've walked it many times, most recently just before Christmas. At that stage it was open until "the tunnel", just above the abseil entry point for canyoners, so I had to reverse the route. There were prominent warning signs and a locked gate preventing further access. Usually that walk is a circuit of about 6km with a reasonably steep entry and exit. Since then the entire track has been closed while they work on it. Oddly I was able to walk through one of the main work sites near the canyon floor, negotiating sandstone slabs, bags of cement and so on. In any case it's a very popular, high traffic short walk and not the type of trip that you would usually associate with the need for a PLB. I'd certainly like a dollar for every European backpacker I've encountered on that track over the years. I can't comment on the canyoning aspect but in both cases I have doubts as to how well a PLB signal would get out from there.

[wello]

My five cents worth.....

The nanny state was in full force at Uluru and the Olgas when I was there in 2008. Setting aside the debate about whether its culturally OK to climb the rock, we were there three days and had no opportunity to climb even if we'd wanted to. There's a very substantial white fence preventing access to the start and a $5000 fine for jumping the fence. The gate is open when conditions are OK, but that means no wind, no rain likely and temperature less than 36.

Out at the Olgas, there is an absolutely sensational walk through the Valley of the Winds that we were fortunate enough to do. This too is closed if the temperature is over 36, despite the existence of two fixed water tanks and a permanent radio to call for help on. (36 is hot for Tassie, but if you're used to hot weather, its quite OK. Hats and plenty of water are essential of course).

All of this most likely occured due to fatalities and the inevitable calls of "they should have done something". Well now "they" have and I for one don't like it. Tassie doesn't have this type of thing yet, and taking personal responsibility and preparing well is the key to avoiding situations that can end in tradgedy. I now carry a PLB and a bivvy sack on day walks, and am much more diligent than I used to be in telling someone where I'm going. Hopefully these precautions will help me avoid getting on the news and will help preserving the free access to the bush we all value so much.

Wello

[Ent]

Yes in Tassie nothing yet but I wonder if a repeat of the facts resulting in the construction of the Scott/Kilvert Hut would bring the nanny state into full gear. Like most things the legislators remain silent and when stung by criticism swing into overdrive with rules and regulations. Given the current law case re the Canberra and NSW fires I am left wondering if fire managements plans will usurp wildlife management plans. That case is yet to be played out but the expectations of the plaintiffs of the state are very significant regardless of the merits of the claims.

Brett