To Wear Or Not To Wear Waterproof Pants...

[ryantmalone]

I'm a pretty big guy who is fitter than I look, and as comes with the territory, its a shocker to buy clothes that fit.

This makes it a bit tricky when I'm planning for a wet weekend, as this one is going to end up closer to Christmas.

So... I've been reading a bit, and it seems that many people just don't use waterproof pants. They will still use a jacket, but find that pants, if anything, just serve to overheat your legs, and can be more of a pain than anything.

So, I'm considering leaving them behind this trip. Or, should I say, not bothering to try and find and buy a new pair before this weekend.

Just wanting to get some thoughts on this from others who both wear and don't wear waterproofs in the wet.

[The Trout Hunter]

..I have many times worn waterproof pants in the past and as you say, I overheat.. I have after these trips tried wearing a quickdry short with a waterproof jacket that hangs below the bum and have found the walking much more comfortable - BUT I guess it depends on how much walking you will be doing and how wet/cold it will be, if you are constantly cruising along and the temps are reasonable, you are going to keep warm in almost any rain this time of year..

I guess it all comes down to the walk conditions.. But I seem to be wearing shorts in Victoria almost all year round whilst hiking these days..



Brad

[Stibb]

I'd say it depends on what jacket you have and what temperature you'll likely experience.
A long jacket and you'll probably be good without
A short jacket and you'll probably be glad you brought them.
Cold, windy and rain? I would say yes, bring them.

I have a half long jacket and have just got myself a pair of wp pants. Wet is ok but cold and wet is just not my thing.

[South_Aussie_Hiker]

I too HATE waterproof overpants, but in certain locations/times of year they are a necessity for someone skinny like me (prone to getting cold). For me, it mainly depends on the wind.

If the rain is not too heavy and the temperature not too cold - I will just go with gaiters and quick drying shorts (provided I have a dry set to change into at the end of the day).

If the conditions are really cold (normally with strong, icy winds) then I will put the overpants on.

I just don't wear them with full length pants underneath (only thin, breathable shorts) or with gaiters - that makes me overheat.

[Tortoise]

High country - always, no question for me. Flatlands - less of an issue, but i always take them anyway. Climbing steeply, wet, warm and muggy - may not wear them. Wet and windy and cold - wouldn't want to be without them.

[wayno]

comes down to the air temp and the wind.... they are cold weather kit for staving off hypothermia especially in cold rain...

[Kinsayder]

I wear them but I'm primarily an alpine man. Seeing that you're going up that way, I'd take them for sure. You might not need them but I think it was mentioned in that other thread that you're expecting rain.

Strangely, my main problem with them is that they're quite loud.

[Hallu]

Montane specify the length of their pants, independently of the waist size. I'm like you, big but not fat, 1.74 m tall and I usually wear pants size 34, length 30, and Montane pants size L and short length fit me perfectly. I don't care about overheating in the wet, it's still better than being soaked. But so far I haven't encountered hot + wet, maybe some Queenslanders could give us some advice.

[forest]

Depends on the location. More and more I'm finding myself ditching the full rain pants. I've a light pair of event pants which I really like too. I'll normally take them if it's alpine though but I'm moving towards something else lately.

I'm prefering a rain wrap. Yes I know it looks like a skirt but it's so much more comfortable in the rain and the weight is like 50g. I'm a runners man so my feet get wet anyway which I can combat other ways, even with waterproof pants. I just find the wrap gives me good water protection to knee level, still enough mobility to step/jump etc and it's heaps cooler as the airflows better than pants. I've a cuben one from zpacks and I'm yet to damage it even after tearing through lawyer vine and log/rock scrabbles which has supprised me. I haven't babied it one bit.
I find if I can keep my thighs protected to some extent I don't really find an issue with cold calves at all. I've only done one cold/wet/windy trip with this set-up into Barrington Tops. Whilst walking with crap conditions I was fine and the temps hovered around -0°C all day with rain and all but gale winds.

I'll also normally take a light pair of wind pants. This lets me have 2 options.
Option 1: Another "water resistant" leg layer if it's really cold and windy that I can wear under the wrap (But they only last about 30min before wetting out, less if it's scrubby/long grass).
Option 2: Or a dry set of pants to wear in camp if my walking pants end up wet. As the wind pants are only 75g it's about the lightest option I can find for a spare dry camp layer. The wind pants over merino thermals are really quite warm.

[wayno]

i know someone who had zpacks make him some waterproof cuben fibre shorts. havent heard if he's used them yet..

[FatCanyoner]

Maybe it's all the canyoning, but I don't mind being wet in the bush. I've never worn waterproof pants, and often don't bother with rain jackets either (I worry I'll destroy them when scrub bashing, so only wear them in really bad conditions). I find a set of polypro thermals are perfect. They dry quick, keep you warm, but don't give you that clammy feeling. Over that goes a pair of quick drying shorts. For cool conditions / lighter rain then the polypro top goes on too. They're cheap, replaceable, and don't restrict your movements at all.

[wayno]

depends on your resistance to the cold. that varies massively from person to person. one person can survice and another person could literally die in the same conditions from hpothermia
its also deceptive if you're on the move generating heat, ayou could be fine not wearing as much, but if something happens and you have to stop moving for a period of time in miserable weather, it can be life or death to have a full storm kit with overtrousers...

[Orion]

I'm prefering a rain wrap.

I'd guess that would be easier to do a curtsey in!

Depends on the location.

Yes, this is it, obviously. Without specific context it's kind of a silly question, like "To wear gloves or not to wear gloves?"
You need them when you need them.

[north-north-west]

I'm a wuss. I hate walking with wet shoes or pants. So if it's raining or the scrub's wet, I'm in the overpants. Usually just with shorts on the warmer weather.

[ryantmalone]

I'm a wuss. I hate walking with wet shoes or pants. So if it's raining or the scrub's wet, I'm in the overpants. Usually just with shorts on the warmer weather.

All good, I wussed out. On my way home from Aussie Disposals. Managed to find some waterproofs, and to my surprise, a Ridgeline Tracer at a nice 80$ as well!

Looks like I'm gonna be bone dry on Bogong!

[wayno]

being a wuss at times has kept me out of a whole lot of trouble

[nq111]

But so far I haven't encountered hot + wet, maybe some Queenslanders could give us some advice.

Hot + wet is a bit of a fallacy in my experience unless the rain is light.

In the tropics when it rains in summer it usually rains hard - like 100mm- 300mm an hour. When it is 'hot' that rain is coming down at maybe 24oc, maybe even 26oc. This is cool but not intolerable for short periods (note when it has been 34oc and 95% humidity prior to raining - water at 24oc feels freezing first up!).

Now water conducts heat much more efficiently then air and your body is about 37oc. So if you are walking in such rain for a few hours it really sucks the heat out of your skin - the constant water flow over the skin really chills and can get surprisingly cold.

I personally find heavy tropical rain more chilling than light, temperate rain. Something that at least sheds the volume of rain contacting your skin (even if you are damp / wet underneath) is required.

In tassie I regularly walk with just quick dry shorts, gaiters and eVent jacket in the rain (as it is light - usually). For slightly heavier rain, the ULA rainskirt is perfect. Waterproof pants would be a good idea for sustained heavier rain and slush, but have managed to date with never using them down there.

[stuey69]

I don't take them unless I know the temps are going to be below about 7 max and there's a possibility of rain or severe wind chill.
At altitude they're always in the pack.
At sea level etc a waste of time, quick drying shorts do the trick.

[slparker]

I use cycling 3/4 length rain shorts or softshell numbers now. Just cover the knees and extend to the gaiters.

[wayno]

rain can be insdious,, to start with it can feel great, cooling you down when you're hot, but as nq writes, it steadily saps the heat from you, cool water continually removing warmth from you, slowly dropping your temperature, you dont bother putting overtrousers on, if it rains long enough and you add wind chill you can look at some serious amount of cooling, often if you can keep walking you will get through just colder for the experience, but its hard to know if you will get out of the elements before hypothermia hits, or you have to stop before you get out o the elements, i know runners who've died running in the rain for an hour. doesnt matter how well you know the weather where you're going you can still get freak weather that trumps it, in NZ even very experienced trampers get caught out with hypothermia when the weather ends up a lot worse than their extensive experience told them it should be... in recent years the weather has been more deceptive... over a period of time , a greater portion of the time the weather is good compared to years gone by, but the bad weather when it comes is worse... average wind speeds have been increasing half to one percent a year since the eighties, some places there are more heavy rain events. global warming might be real but its also changed weather patterns exposing some places to more cold weather... i'm used to seeing it snow in the south island in summer, sometimes theres reasonable dumps

[ryantmalone]

rain can be insdious,, to start with it can feel great, cooling you down when you're hot, but as nq writes, it steadily saps the heat from you, cool water continually removing warmth from you, slowly dropping your temperature, you dont bother putting overtrousers on, if it rains long enough and you add wind chill you can look at some serious amount of cooling, often if you can keep walking you will get through just colder for the experience, but its hard to know if you will get out of the elements before hypothermia hits, or you have to stop before you get out o the elements, i know runners who've died running in the rain for an hour. doesnt matter how well you know the weather where you're going you can still get freak weather that trumps it, in NZ even very experienced trampers get caught out with hypothermia when the weather ends up a lot worse than their extensive experience told them it should be... in recent years the weather has been more deceptive... over a period of time , a greater portion of the time the weather is good compared to years gone by, but the bad weather when it comes is worse... average wind speeds have been increasing half to one percent a year since the eighties, some places there are more heavy rain events. global warming might be real but its also changed weather patterns exposing some places to more cold weather... i'm used to seeing it snow in the south island in summer, sometimes theres reasonable dumps

I had an experience when I was a teen, hiked up Helicopter Spur, it was raining slightly, and VERY cold. After 30 minutes of walking, body heat rose, and started to take off layers, until I was in shorts and a singlet, completely comfortable of course.

Amateur mistake, I know...

So, when we reached the top, found a camp spot just before the turn off for Mt Magdala, and the second I dropped my pack, the cold set in, and I started to become hypothermic within a matter of seconds. My father was trying to get me to help pitch the tent, but I kept sitting down, trying to drink water, and so on.

Now, If I hadn't have been exposed to the cold for so long, And amplified it by the fact that my clothes were wet, I'd have been fine. No doubt about that.

So, with that said, I'll definitely be bringing rain pants this weekend.

[slparker]

The other ingredient is fuel, if heat is pouring out one end add food into the other. I agree wet + wind is a pernicious mix, I get so hot walking that I've made the mistake of under dressing for the wet. Th problem with me is that if I add a layer I get too hot. Decided now that whenever I stop I throw a synthetic puffy on over the top whether its dry and cold or wet and cold. That and eat something at least every 30 mins when working hard.

[wayno]

with hypothermia, there is a phase after it starts where the blood rushes bacck to the skin and it makes you feel very hot. and people will remove clothes right at the point when its the worst possible time to do so.. it's only recently been recognised that this happens. people are often irational by that stage as well. you may find if you tell someone in this state to put their clothes back on, tehy won't.
it happens with old people in winter, a body will be found in a house naked or near naked. and the police will get involved suspecting faul play but none is found, for a long time no one could understand why on the colder days of the year this was happening until, it was discovered about the phase with hypothermia where people feel hot....

[nq111]

The other ingredient is fuel, if heat is pouring out one end add food into the other. I agree wet + wind is a pernicious mix, I get so hot walking that I've made the mistake of under dressing for the wet. Th problem with me is that if I add a layer I get too hot. Decided now that whenever I stop I throw a synthetic puffy on over the top whether its dry and cold or wet and cold. That and eat something at least every 30 mins when working hard.

Agree. I once came close to hypothermia as a student - with limited funds I decided to put my last dollars into fuel for a car to go climb a mountain and was too proud to admit all i had for dinner was a muesli bar and nothing for breakfast. 1200m of gain later and a bit cold and windy and I was not in a good way. Luckily my buddy was from an even colder area and sensible (and much better fed!) and shepherded me back to safe place to get warm (And gave me some food).

I believe most people die from doing stupid things in the early stages of hypothermia rather than dying from the cold per se.

[wayno]

yupp best bet with hypotermia is try and avoid it at all costs, if you suspect you are coming down with hypothermia, act immediately to do something about it and get warmer. including eat. as hypothermia comes on you might as well be thoroughly drunk considering how poor your decision making will be.. so having the old storm trou if you suspect cold or wet weather is always a good bet..