Brands that aren't/are what they once were-Insert Brand

[norts]

I would like to say I used Remote Equipment, for my Macpac Mircrolight, darn mice/rats at Lake Cygnus.
Very good service and the repair is holding up and looks very professional.
Well done Ray


Roger

[Macca81]

Amazing the number of us who own sewing machines and who lust after bigger and stronger ones too.

True that!

[Krunel]

I bought my first Minaret around 98, used it in sun, mud, snow, rain, blizzard... After heaps of use the fly inevitably began to degrade from sun damage. I was a huge fan of the tent and bought another around 07. The new Minaret was lighter and cheaper... and not made in nz. In good weather the new Minaret was just as good as the old. In poor weather (or on snow) the tent floor leaked. I warrantied it after a poor experience camping on snow in Tasmania - no way should a floor let through so much moisture in otherwise good weather. That was in 08 or 09. Since then I've not done much hiking & used the Minaret infrequently. However I am currently in Tas using the replacement Minaret... the tent floor failed in driving rain on the wooden tent platforms of the Western Arthurs. Coincidently there was another group with a Minaret who had the same problem - water coming through the floor. Other tents in their group did not. Same night, same location, all camped on tent platforms.

The contrast for me is : using the original Minaret I had no water through the floor (one memorable occasion near Federation the floor was like a water bed but no leaks); using two of the new minarets the floor leaks. My experience supports the op. The tent floor on the Minaret has changed for the worse.

[Hallu]

So far I have no complaint about MacPac tents and packs, but I do regarding their clothing. I own several of their merino shirts/jackets/baselayers, and compared to Icebreaker products, they're rubbish, and often more expensive. Buttons fall off, stitches are really fragile, the material is too thin, and for some reason their merino retain more odours. I also have a softshell merino, which looks good and is wind proof, but isn't waterproof one bit, water doesn't even bead on the material, it just spill on the fabric and wet the interior. So now I've definitely abandoned MacPac for clothing.

[cooee]

Probably 50 % of my gear is Macpac, never had a problem with it. My wife and l have two packs that are just on 20 years old and they are still going strong. Only real gripe l have on their clothing is there sizing!!! Normally I’m a Large but most things l buy from them have to be an XXL.

[Hallu]

Sizing is small for all NZ brands. I need XL for both MacPac and Icebreaker. It's actually better for me, as the items on sale that go the fastest are usually medium and large. And as I am a large for American brands (Arc'teryx, Patagonia etc...) they're harder to find on sale for me.

[radson]

My 2c. Every 2 months I take a little tour of the shops on Kent St in Sydney to see what is around. With Macpac next to Kathmandu basically its pretty hard to differentiate their goods. Macpac for me seems stuck in 1995 ala Mountain Designs . I understand that most gear business models seems to revolve around catering to the masses and that makes sense. And like any goods clearly there are issues of elitism, ego and snobbery when it comes to gear purchases but whoaa Macpac just seems so out of date and heavy. I too was surprised at the comments about not changing design for 20 years

Leading with Burton etc, gear manufacturers I believe will start to introduce more global pricing policies. The grip of the aussie distributor charging double for imported goods is waning, We all know how to get gear cheaper than buying in house. I see Kathmandu has a legitimate business model being cheap and nasty, I see the high end goods like Patagonia, Arcteryx, Rab, carving out their niches. I guess Macpac just wants to be Kathmandu Premium.

[Hallu]

Well Macpac is gonna reply that that's Kathmandu who's the sous-MacPac . Personally I'm not that concerned with the design, as long as it's durable. But you're right : MacPac "feels" out of date. This is pretty obvious when you have a look at their website. It's a mess, with old school design trumping practicality. You never understand what's on sale and what's not, navigating through products is a nightmare, there are many bugs, and they only recently offered free shipping. Lucky for them their customer service is good.

A couple of easy mistakes to correct :

-they separate trek, mountain and endurance gear. What for ? Am I not allowed to do a trek in a mountain ? If I want light gear for a trek do I have to look into the endurance section ? It's totally counter intuitive, just sort it out by weight, price, temperature, I don't know, but not this.
-for the selection of size and color, you need to choose manually even for items with only one size and one color such as tents. It's a complete waste of time, takes a couple of minutes for the webmaster to correct this...
-the description of items : you have "description" "technical features" "specification" "design" etc... basically vague terms that mean more or less the same thing, while a simple table would be so easier... Again a simple example : for sleeping bags, you don't see the temp rating right away, which you should, in huge colored letters (no color anywhere in the descriptions...)... And when you click "temp rating", what do you get ? A definition of temp rating for sleeping bags...
-the photos are also desperately missing : only one photo of each item, no zoom, one angle, even for tents and packs...
-you go to pants and jackets : you can't even select only hardshells, softshells, regular etc...

In this matter, Kathmandu's website is 10 times better.

[etrangere]

There was a time I lusted after macpac gear. But now it just smells of Kathmandu poor quality and over inflated recommended retail price with the usual "sales and discounts" advertised periodically which doesn't even entice me into their store at all. Its a real shame.

[Strider]

I agree about Macpac's website. I used to enjoy browsing it regularly for sale items, and made purchases accordingly. Now I don't even understand how or where to start looking.

It definitely has that "Kathmandu smell" these days. But, then again, Jan Cameron does have a 20% (?) shareholding in the business, so it is understandable that prior methods of success might again be applied. However, it is unlikely such strategies would still be relevant given changes observed in the industry and its associated markets. It really is difficult to pinpoint what direction Macpac is attempting to take?

[nq111]

There was a time I lusted after macpac gear. But now it just smells of Kathmandu poor quality and over inflated recommended retail price with the usual "sales and discounts" advertised periodically which doesn't even entice me into their store at all. Its a real shame.

Macpac are just trying to find a position in the market that they can compete.

I think half their issue from the likes of us on this forum now is that with internet sales and reviews, they are competing in a much bigger pond and their products don't stand out so much. It is pretty hard for any brand in the outdoor game to do well across lots of products - i am sure most people on this forum have almost as many brands as articles of gear because they try to get the proven specialist for each item.

I think they need to compete a little 'lower brow' to get a reasonable market out of Aust / NZ to sustain a business. Walkers who are as dedicated / obsessive as those on this forum are a very small segment and macpac would go broke even if we all bought only macpac gear but they didn't sell to anyone else. However they need some presence at our end of the market to give their products credibility to the other 99% of the market. Same tactic as North Face selling VE25 tents for around $500 - they wouldn't get rich selling these quality tents at those prices however they get the kudos and name in the market when the shots of Everest have a line of yellow North Faces. The college kids line up for North Face puffy jackets because the brand has credibility.

Having said that, I don't have any Macpac items anymore. I have looked at their site and stores from time to time but never in recent years have I thought they had a better design/value product then I could get elsewhere. 20 years ago, i would have looked at the same items and drooled - the pond of gear to choose from was so much smaller.

Also, I do appreciate blacksheep's presence on this forum - he gets beat on pretty bad some times but keeps coming back and contributing in a (mostly ) professional way. I think we would all have a different perspective if we were actually trying to design and market gear as a viable business.

[dannnnn]

i have bought a fair bit of macpac gear lately (down bag, down jacket, merino active gear, street wear) and it seems pretty decent quality gear that's well priced. i wouldn't say it's gone to the dogs. it's certainly a lot better quality than any of the few bits of kathmandu gear i've owned. it's not the absolute top-of-the-range stuff, but i would put it at the upper end of the mid market.

the main thing they need to get right is pricing. but that's not just macpac - the "price high, sale low" model seems to be invading all retailers across many industries. that, and currency changes introducing foreign competition, just makes buying anything a bit of a battle.

[vagrom]

It's a pity about the Minaret's floor problems. My Kiwi made Microlight's floor has kept me dry during years of Tassie walking and that means the water bed effect every now and then. So with the Microlight at least, Macpac seems to be on a winner as i've continued to see it in use and in forum photos. It presents a low, clean profile that stands up well in storms or rather, is somehow shaped to handle some hours of solid buffeting without much grief. I think this is helped by the fact that wind direction swings and the little Microlight bears up or flexes well during the period of solid, side-on stuff that sees others sometimes having to up stakes.
This tent is easy to find "on sale" for $300 which makes it ideal for entry level walkers who can keep it for years, a great little back-up for when they move on to a two-person tent. It's been a winner down under at least and hopefully Macpac find it that way as well.
With the Cascade (Pack), once and perhaps still regularly seen on-track, complex, jargon filled harnessing have made them unsuitable for going off track with so much "stuff" that traps bush. It's no longer a clean design but I expect that the reintroduced Torre (some years ago), with it's single compartment, was really always the experienced walkers option.
So, to stay afloat I guess Macpac have had to look in Kathmandu's direction while finding a way to attractively price and supply models that have built a following over years. The Minaret however, clearly needs a bit of work. Bummer.

[Strider]

Macpac are just trying to find a position in the market that they can compete.

I don't believe this for a second - we are talking about a business that was established over 20 years ago. If they did not know their position they would not be with us today, regardless of the changes of ownership.

I do find this discussion very interesting though

[Strider]

Also, I do appreciate blacksheep's presence on this forum - he gets beat on pretty bad some times but keeps coming back and contributing in a (mostly ) professional way. I think we would all have a different perspective if we were actually trying to design and market gear as a viable business.

And he will no doubt see value in this discussion, despite its nuances

[nq111]

I don't believe this for a second - we are talking about a business that was established over 20 years ago. If they did not know their position they would not be with us today, regardless of the changes of ownership.

I do find this discussion very interesting though

Hmmm - unfortunately the market is not a static thing. Many companies go broke not because they put out poorer products but because they couldn't change as fast as the market did. Blackberry anyone?

[Hallu]

I agree with the pricing problem : I have NEVER bought a MacPac product that wasn't on sale. And I'm sure many are in this situation. What does this mean ? That the retail prices are a racket, plain and simple. And the problem is, for that same price (on sale) you get better products from America, even when sold on Bivouac thanks to their sales, not only bought on a US store and shipped using a forwarding company. So the fact that MacPac lost a part of their credibility with less durable products (as many said on this topic) and regular sales was actually a mistake : it was their only chance to stand out on the market, by being the "Southern hemisphere Arc'teryx" which they clearly aren't. Now they are mostly an overpriced Kathmandu with slightly better products but a less practical website, they need to bounce back.

[Strider]

I don't believe this for a second - we are talking about a business that was established over 20 years ago. If they did not know their position they would not be with us today, regardless of the changes of ownership.

I do find this discussion very interesting though

Hmmm - unfortunately the market is not a static thing. Many companies go broke not because they put out poorer products but because they couldn't change as fast as the market did. Blackberry anyone?

My point exactly. Which really makes me wonder what's going on at Macpac. Would make for an interesting analysis!

[Strider]

I agree with the pricing problem : I have NEVER bought a MacPac product that wasn't on sale. And I'm sure many are in this situation. What does this mean ? That the retail prices are a racket, plain and simple.

This is just marketing departments doing what they do. But it is the strategy that underpins this that has me wondering. If Macpac is following the Kathmandu model, then they will have recognised it has limited lifespan. Short-term gains for long-term pain? I doubt it.

[Rob A]

Frankly, Id trust people who have set up and run successful businesses in the past to be able to maintain a better track record than the average armchair internet genius.

[ILUVSWTAS]

Probably 50 % of my gear is Macpac, never had a problem with it. My wife and l have two packs that are just on 20 years old

This is the point of the thread I believe, 20 years ago macpac were considered top of the range. Now days most walkers I know dont rate macpac gear very highly at all. Has the gear quality declined? Or is there just better products being made by more competition brands today?

Personally I think it's a combination of the 2.

[blacksheep]

woof

[wayno]

I"d still rate their packs on the whole... if you want something sturdy to take bush bashing..
i've got a cascade, but havent used it a lot, pretty sturdy construction, had various day packs that are solidly made and taken a lot of use without problem.
most of their stuff isnt for the lightweight crowd though

[ILUVSWTAS]

I"d still rate their packs on the whole... if you want something sturdy to take bush bashing..
i've got a cascade

I'd agree with this. Have also had a cascade or 2, but I personally find the harness very uncomfortable.

[wayno]

i didnt have problems with the hardness but i didnt use it on a rough track other than repeat river crossings, so i didnt need a particularly dynamic range of motion, certainly well padded but not as flexible as other brands i've tried.

[Jack o]

I was in Macpac the other day considering the Cascade 90FL as a possible replacement for my big old Karrimor which I have been using for multi day treks for the past 20 odd years, however I was not impressed with the Cascade’s waste belt, which seemed very narrow, thin and quite slippery. I was concerned that the belt may excessively self loosen, particularly with a heavy shifting load (25kg) as when tramping over rough or uneven terrain. My mate has this problem with his Tatonka 90 and its an absolute pain on a long trip.
Furthermore the Macpac sales assistant only had a relatively small and inadequate test weight to load the pack (more suited to a day pack) which meant I couldn’t really assess the pack much in the shop. She also seemed to not understand why I wanted a big pack and kept trying to steer me towards smaller and cheaper packs like the Glissade, even though I explained to her that I wanted it for multi-day treks and I already owned smaller rucksacks…. but that’s another story.

Has anyone experienced problems with the Cascade 90 waist belt? I’m particularly interested in those who hike with a heavy load over uneven terrain.

[wayno]

mine is the 90, i've done a four day cold weather trip under tent with it, roughest terrain was a rocky river bed i had to cross multiple times, i had no problems with .
it.. i would have had the best part of an 18 kilo load....

[wayno]

my cascade model is around five years old...

[Giddy_up]

Well I just purchased a Cascade 65 today. Reason behind the purchase was very simple really, I was having trouble getting a pack this size to fit me properly. I tried the Cascade 65 on in the shop and it was still not right but the staff got busy to see what they could do. These packs "only" come in size 3 harness, so whilst the length of the pack was OK the straps on a size 3 were to small so we needed size 4 harness straps, so the Frankenpac as the staff started to call it was pieced together and had arrived and it was time to try the fit. After an hour of walking around the store with 15kgs in the bag and it adjusted to my needs, It is spot on. The process to achieve this was simple, I sent a pm to blacksheep about my requirements and what had happened at the store with the sizing issue, and between Cam and the Brisbane store (Tim) I got a 65l pack that is perfect. These guys went beyond the norm to provide me with a bespoke product that is just right for me.
The service that I have received from the Macpac team has been good old fashioned care and attention to detail with no compromise and it was a pleasure to buy their product.
Cam keep up the good work and please maintain your input into this forum as I for one really appreciate it.
G_U

[wayno]

its not that unusuAL . some brands mix and match belts with packs as part of their design, osprey does, i got a smaller belt for my aether with a larger back length