Newby (oldie) thinking about a GPS. What to buy

[andrewa]

At 50, I'm proud to have survived 35yrs of bushwalking/ski touring without ever being " permanently disorientated". I've had some situations where I've not been entirely sure of my position, but eventually been able to work it out.

Last year on Bogong in a whiteout in winter I was several hundred meters off course to the top of The Eskdale spur from Cairn Gully ( this was an intuitive route based on probable 50 trips out of Cairn Gully, and not based on compass useage). My mates GPS made our destination clear. I was heading way east. Practically I would eventually have hit the pole line, and I'm sure I would have sorted it out, but its raised the issue of there being times when a GPS might be useful.

What have youse all found out there in the GPS market?

Andrew A

[iGBH]

IMO best value at the moment is Garmin Oregon 450 from states for $199.

If you want latest and greatest then Oregon 600 is released in coming weeks - looks to be a top unit.

[Aushiker]

Did some research ... addressed my misunderstanding.

Andrew

[neilmny]

I have a Garmin Etrex Vista Hcx and I'm very happy with it.
What ever you get make sure it has a base map (fairly useless) and that you can install topo maps.

[sthughes]

Just got a Garmin Rino 650. Brilliant.
Therefore, assuming you don't want the built in UHF, I'd second the Oregon recommendation as it has a similar interface and feature set to the Rino.
Shame there is nothing with the quad helix antenna and the touch driven interface (except the Rino, with the extra UHF antenna etc. that most people don't want).
Also the speed of the Rino over my old Etrex Venture, or even my mates 62s is fantastic (i.e. map loading/panning times etc).

[Miyata610]

For the very rare occasions that you might need a gps, just use your smartphone (assuming it has a gps and isn't just using tower triangulation or some such). Get a waterproof case. Get an external usb power source if paranoid.

[photohiker]

I'd suggest an Etrex 20 or 30.

I've no problem with the larger touch screen devices other than the fact that touch screens and gloves don't get along very well. A bigger screen is always handy, but they consume more power, therefore you need to carry more batteries and change them more frequently. As far as finding your route in whiteout conditions just about any current GPS in the hands of someone experienced in its use will be just fine. A mapping GPS makes the job easier, especially if on the fly route planning becomes necessary.

[Aushiker]

I'd suggest an Etrex 20 or 30.

I've no problem with the larger touch screen devices other than the fact that touch screens and gloves don't get along very well.

I use a Garmin Edge 810 and before that an 800 on my bike I have not had any issues using gloves with it and haven't heard anything to suggest that there is an issue. Do the likes of the Oregon models use a different touch-screen technology?

I know the Edge models use a different technology from smart phones.

Andrew

[Strider]

I've no problem with the larger touch screen devices other than the fact that touch screens and gloves don't get along very well.

Pretty sure these devices use resistive, rather than capacitive, touch screens.

[sthughes]

Yeah, my Rino works just as well with gloves as it does without. Perhaps using big thick winter mitts might be difficult just as far as precision is concerned? But the icons etc are pretty chunky.

[Clusterpod]

I'm yet to be convinced by any new features to replace my HCx.

Though an integrated Sat-phone, mapping GPS and PLB would be a good device.

[photohiker]

IMO best value at the moment is Garmin Oregon 450 from states for $199.

If you want latest and greatest then Oregon 600 is released in coming weeks - looks to be a top unit.

Yes, the 600 series looks to be a significant upgrade:



Re Gloves. I've only played with an oregon once and tried gloves with it - not a fan. Maybe my fingers are too chunky. Suggest try before buy. If you don't use a current quality smartphone then you may not notice so much.

The new 600 series Oregon has gone from Resistive to Capacitive. No idea if that will help or hinder on the 600, but for phones it requires the use of compatible gloves (or luck)

[Ent]

Hi

An awful lot of GPSs are sold that never get used as they have frustrating geek driven interfaces that defy the ability of many people. Mistakenly people think that I am geek lover of GPS so various ones crop up for me to attempt to figure out, with Magellan units being my pet hate as Hardly Normal flog them with more hogwash than ethics. Tasmap even make life harder as you can not set it on one datum scale as maps are still been sold on the older datum. Try explaining to person with age related reading eyes how to change datums and you are a better person than me. As for mapping GPSs they can be frustrating as Garmin maps do not understand that many people buying them are bushwalkers so have minimal tracks loaded and as for claims on resolution, well I will leave muttering about marketing hype. In all, most GPSs are just poorly human engineered that make recommending them dangerous.

Best thing is to define what you want.

If it is something as simple as the co-ordinates then go for the simplest and cheapest unit with the biggest display that you can find and the minimum number of buttons. A Garmin Extrex 10 at $99 will do the job and strong enough to be launched at a tree and still survive.

If you decide that data logging and playing with tracks on a computer is your thing then get ready for a long learning curve. Ironically the so called mapping units can actually be better to use than the huge range between them and a base Extrex. Smart phones such as an iPhone running Memorymap can be remarkably effective but then you have the cost of a waterproof case plus expenditure on battery packs to charge it. Also iPhone's will struggle to get a signal lock in steep forested valleys plus eat power plus also a bump can result in things going very strange as you might inadvertently select some weird menu option.

A GPS in the hands of a skilled operator can make it appear like magic following tracks in white-out conditions but for many people this is just a dream. The best thing I can recommend is chat to a friend that uses one and bot some lessons from him/her and if you understand them buy the exact same unit and make sure that you get their phone number.

I use a Fenix watch (prone to have issues so not to be trusted on always working) loaded with tracks from OSM to follow tracks and back track as it is easy to reference on the wrist. I use a Garmin 62S as my data logging GPS but that is about to be launched at a tree and be replaced by the far more friendly Garmin Rino. Also I use a smartphone loaded with maps but (mutter grumble, etc, etc) Tasmap have not released the promised electronic maps so it becomes and exercise in high geek to get them loaded. I tried Memorymap and while it is quaint to use maps as old as me I much prefer newer maps.

Cheers

[andrewa]

Thx for that Ent and others. I'm not into data logging, but really only want to be able to work out where I am occasionally, or find something where I have left it. I would normally carry a map anyway, so it just establishing my coordinates if I can't see coz of weather, and working out which direction I want to go. The example I gave of Bogong is about as much as I would imagine using it.

Andrew A

[photohiker]

If it's just co-ordinates you want, base Etrex would be the go.

[Ent]

Hi

Yeap base model Garmin Extrex 10 sounds like the go and should set you back under $99 and run on AA batteries and be pretty indestructible. Just be aware that they do not come with data cables so tracks are not uploadable to the computer without it.

If you have an iPone check out some free apps that will give co-ordinaries in the two Australian standard datums. Might help get an idea on navigating by co-ordinaries as nothing like practice.

Cheers

Cheers

[north-north-west]

... with Magellan units being my pet hate as Hardly Normal flog them with more hogwash than ethics.

You condemn the entire brand because of one retailer with questionable business practices? This is not entirely logical, sunshine.

[Ent]

... with Magellan units being my pet hate as Hardly Normal flog them with more hogwash than ethics.

You condemn the entire brand because of one retailer with questionable business practices? This is not entirely logical, sunshine.

I have looked at more than a few models in the Magellan range and found them rather slow, liable to lock up for no reason plus often read reports of the challenges Luddites face getting the computer software to talk to the units. Checked out various forums and these "features" crop up. Also yet to find any reports of them being able to use OSM. A community based mapping project with active contributors in tens if not hundred of thousands that is slowly becoming a viable alternative to commercial maps.

Long live and prosper.

[photohiker]

Also yet to find any reports of them being able to use OSM. A community based mapping project with active contributors in tens if not hundred of thousands that is slowly becoming a viable alternative to commercial maps..

Check on GPSAustralia, looks to be some activity on OSM maps for Magellan.

I get the impression that the Magellans aren't as easy to get 3rd party mapping for which is a pity. Never played with a Magellen GPS so cannot comment on the hardware itself.

[Ent]

Also yet to find any reports of them being able to use OSM. A community based mapping project with active contributors in tens if not hundred of thousands that is slowly becoming a viable alternative to commercial maps..

Check on GPSAustralia, looks to be some activity on OSM maps for Magellan.

I get the impression that the Magellans aren't as easy to get 3rd party mapping for which is a pity. Never played with a Magellen GPS so cannot comment on the hardware itself.

Be good if Magellan wakes up that there is a huge and growing movement to tap into. I believe that is more due to a dedicated group of hackers that OSM can be developed for Garmins and maybe Magellan does not have the user base to justify the effort until now. At least Garmin has not tried to block this. Did notice that one commercial map system (a trial) I loaded took out my Garmin map installer yet none of the non commercial ones did. They all played nicely with Garmin's software.

Magellan hardware was interesting as I played with two units and both locked up on me and had to have the batteries removed. The sales assistant commented that more than a few have complained so they just swap the customers over to Garmins. Now for the record Garmin is not my favorite company and their Edge 305 and Fenix watch have driven me to distraction with dubious reliability. My Garmin 62S is an example of how not to program a user interface but the unit itself is rock solid. Falling in love with my Rino as this shows that Garmin can get things right in a big way. Must admit when my Fenix is working and not locked solid it is a brilliant piece of kit.

Cheers

[colinm]

I have a Garmin Etrex 30, had a Vista Cx. Both have been reliable and rock solid. Battery life was a major determinant for me, the Etrex range advertise (and deliver) over 20hrs.

I transfer data to and from the device(s) using only open source s/w. It's difficult to do when you want to generate garmin native maps, but it is possible. For other things, you can upload KML files to the thing (e30, not VCx.)

OP says he doesn't need/want the ability to track fulltime and map, but I think ... try it you may like it.

[north-north-west]

I have looked at more than a few models in the Magellan range and found them rather slow, liable to lock up for no reason plus often read reports of the challenges Luddites face getting the computer software to talk to the units.

Mine's only ever locked up three times, and on each occasion it was due to receiving a pretty solid knock due to my falling. And it's easy to fix, you just remove and replace the batteries.
And the PC interface has never given me any trouble, with either the desktop or the laptop. *shrug* Given all your whinging about Garmin's user interface, I'm glad I went with the Mag.

[walkinTas]

The new one has never locked up, the old 500 did a few times but the newer 510, never. As for the challenge talking to the PC - what challenge. Plug it in turn it on. 1001, 1002, 1003, 1004, 1005, 1006, 1007, 1008, 1009 - press connect to PC button - 1010, 1011, 1012, 1013 - connected to PC - 1014, 1015, 106, 1017, 1018, 1019 - Magellan device loaded as F: drive (Windows 7). Open Windows Explored and there it is. Open Google Earth and there it is. Open Ozi-Explorer, there it is. Vantage Point is not much chop. Ozi-Explorer is OKish.

[Onestepmore]

Magellan 710 users here. I think we could have gone with a lesser version, as it has lots of features we have yet to use

[Ent]

GPS interface is the key as well a reliability of the unit. My Garmin 62s apart from my poor choice of a storage bag with a magnetic clip has never missed a beat. I found out that the unit used the magnetic compass to point track up rather than the GPS movement as on models not equipped with a compass and the clip naturally stuffed up the compass. Garmin had a good button interface for the older units and not bad one for the touch screens but on the 62S they used by the the look of it the touch screen interface with buttons and this is not a happy compromise. The Garmin Rino I have is a great unit with a good touch screen interface and the ability to send locations between units over a wide area and apart from cost and the bulk related to the built in UHF radio a unit to be commended. Still one turned up with a stuffed l-ion battery pack. The Extrex 10 was a basic unit but did not miss a beat but then the lug holding the lanyard failed and a look at it revealed a very poor plastic casting. I know of a Garmin that went through a heavy duty washing machine cycle and apart from lines on the screen still works. The Fenix has very good ability to customize the screen but still a bit puzzled how to change the set up of screens when not in GPS mode. Great unit but frustratingly unreliable. Had a Garmin 305 Edge die for no good reasons and two of my friends ones did due to a common fault of poor soldering in the USB connector that was resolved with a set of magnifying glasses and soldering iron.

It is not until you live with a respective unit that your find the up and downsides but sadly most reviews are short test with at times rather rose colour glasses. Rarely do you read that they sent back three units before they got one that worked at the date of the review but years later such things get mentioned. Always interesting to read the user comments, providing they are not expunge by an overly protective domain controller. The 62S for example is brilliant with Nimh and Lithium batteries but a total pain with alkaline as it complains that it does not have enough power to do things and start shutting down even with near new batteries. I recommend anyone have in place a data recovery strategy to deal with Basecamp when a computer fails as even with a backup you need to do a lot of data mining to find the data file and even then could be caught out if you have not keep Basecamp up to the latest version. Also you have unexpected challenges depending on the firmware versions. So it is not surprising that someone can rave about a unit and another rave against it. Even on Garmin website users have to form on mass before Garmin will admit to a problem. Once the issue is fixed say a driver then people return to an even keel.

One thing I have noticed is people complain like mad with a new unit and once they have worked around the issues or learned what to do they are remarkably forgiving of the unit and critical of new users or bad reports. Had I had a Rino interface first up I would have been a lot less critical of Garmins. The Fenix reliability issue is cropping up more and more on the web. It is a fickled beast that can survive in harsh conditions but then lock up terminally in the car on the way to a bushwalk only to come back to life when plugged into a computer. I am sure more than a few good units are out there so good luck to their owners

I suppose I could only post positive reports and that would make some happy but I will always post the good, the bad, and the ugly and accept that some just want to see this as whinging but such is the life on forums.

Cheers