what tent for high winds?

[Dutchy]

Ok, this might sound like a fairly general question.... But i'm thinking of buying a new tent to replace my Mountain Hardwear Skyledge 2.1.
Despite this being a fantastic tent (pretty light, pretty sturdy, well built), in higher winds it does worry me a bit. So when looking at something that can cop a bit of a beating, are 4 season tents the only proper option? I am looking at the MSR Fury and Hilleberg Janno2, but the hilleberg might be pushing it for price....
I've owned a MSR Mutha Hubba HP3 in which i explored Canada and Alaska, and condensation was an issue (only 2 people in it). After 4 weeks of car camping with it, mould started growing in the fabric of the inner tent. MSR was great though, and after explaining what we were doing (never storing the tent for more than 24 hours wet) they agreed to give us a brand new one after the trip! I sold the HP3 and now have the regular mesh version, much better suited for Aus... But it has made me a little hesitant about 4 season tents. Also wondering if a 4 season tent might be too warm in summer in Aus?
Does anyone use a Fury year round?
What other tent would qualify? 3 Season tents that are strong.... outdoorgearlab.com seems to think most 3 seasons arent all that strong....
Stuff i intent to do: Alpine camping (prefer the high and open areas.... hence the strength being an issue), snow camping in the high country, NZ and Tassie trips, and "regular" trips in Victoria....

[Moondog55]

The main issue in my experience is whether or not the guy-out lines are attached to the frame of the tent, if the guys are solidly anchored to the poles [especially where poles cross] it makes the tent more secure.
In many of my lighter tents I have added velcro to a seam where lines are sewn into the tent to give this added strength.
All other things being equal then more poles should give more strength and more places to sew tie-downs, but many high altitude tents use only 2 poles. Greater size means more surface area to catch the wind too so the bigger the tent it follows that to be as strong it would need more poles and perhaps stronger poles as well.
Tipis are an exception to the many poles rule but the single pole is usually a strong one.
My strongest tents are the Chouinard/BD Megamid single pole tipi and my Fairydown Plateau a 4 pole dome tunnel/hybrid with 6 guy lines and the ability to add 4 + more where poles cross

[Dutchy]

i totally agree on the guy lines! I've had tents that aren't all that suitable for high winds (mutha hubba and skyledge) in iffy weather and the guy lines take a lot of the force off the poles and fabric. I like my tents to be freestanding, and not something i want to compromise on.

[Dutchy]

MSR Fury: about $700, 3.3 kg's, seems to get good reviews....and value for money might be my pick...
Hilleberg Jannu2: about $800, seems the best "all round" tent around, very tempted....
Hilleberg Allak: about $900, 3.1 kg's, bombproof so they say....
Crux Storm: $650 - $800, 3 kg's,
MacPac Plateau: $800, 4.2 kg's (getting too heavy for me), great reviews

Eureka 5th season EXO, Hilleberg Saivo and others are too heavy (over 4.5 kg's)

[Moondog55]

My Plateau is the older External frame version but a very strong tent, a little small for 3 people

[andrewbish]

Tunnel tents in general are a good option. Have a look at the Olympus (3.1kg) and Minaret (2.4) models from Macpac.

[Gusto]

I have an Aarn Pacer 2. It would be the best tent I've ever used with respect to wind. The reason for this is the highest poles are a very strong combination of walking poles and metal tubing. The two smaller poles are quite low to the ground. Also numerous guy ropes etc.

I guess the hidden moral of this story is that if you can survive with a small tent that still has numerous poles then it should be quite study in the wind.

I would also presume that as a generalization that dome tents would have a larger fabric surface area and a much higher centre of surface area too. So the wind will be pushing up high on the tent. Would make it less stable. I guess this would easily be compensated for though by adding extra poles.

[Franco]

Hi Dutchy,
If 3kg or so is OK for you , I am thinking of selling my Bibler Pinon.
The Allak is very similar to it (3 poles,fully freestanding) Mine is 2.88kg with 6 pegs and stuff sack.
I'll post some details in the gear for sale section.
Franco

[ninjapuppet]

Dutchy you seem to only prefer dome mountaineering tents? Tunnel tents will hand high winds better.
I have snapped a skyledge 2.1 pole in about 70kph winds, so its not a tent I would take to wild places. Our club has a few of these and even at the club i saw 3 different skyledges with damaged poles (but that may also be from user error in setting up as theres alot of newbies in the club)

Keep in mind the fury can often be had for much less than 700 while the jannu cant. I sold a fury here for 300 that was near new. If you go for a fury, make sure its the newer version with clips. My version was the older one with pole sleeves, and it was a real struggle to set it up for fear of tearing the tent apart. Felt that the tent was slightly too small for the supplied poles.

[alanoutgear]

I've got a Hileberg Nammatj 2 and while I've had it in high winds (and rain) with no probs, the attached video shows how to pitch a Nammatj in 112 km/hr winds, as well as showing it handling these winds end on and side on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eFAyKMz314

[Giddy_up]

Wow, that is such a good video. I have never seen double guyed and double pegging like that's before.
Hope I never have to as well!!!!!!


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[bailz66]

Hi Dutchy,
If 3kg or so is OK for you , I am thinking of selling my Bibler Pinon.
The Allak is very similar to it (3 poles,fully freestanding) Mine is 2.88kg with 6 pegs and stuff sack.
I'll post some details in the gear for sale section.
Franco

I use this tent as well and it survived 100k gusts on the high plains in victoria. We were caught in a blizzard and needed to set up an emergency shelter. It survived the night easily although it was pretty cramped. Although it is a small tent there is space at each end of the tent to store packs, shoes ect.

[photonaturally]

To highjack this post a little. It seems the main concern is poles snapping. What if the tent uses trekking poles.
I cannot envision the wind snapping a trekking pole. But then again I have not been in any apocalyptic conditions either.
I have the lightheart solong 6, hence my question about trekking poles vs tent poles.

[tibboh]

Check this out......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLligRPO ... detailpage

[Onestepmore]

Wow, that is such a good video. I have never seen double guyed and double pegging like that's before.
Hope I never have to as well!!!!!!


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Even the lighter weight Hillebergs such as the Red Label Nallo have the double guys. They are super easy to adjust tension. Also, tension is taken off the fabric by there being a tape support that wraps around the pole and then guyed out, taking more strain on the pole instead.
They avoid having large flat expanses of unsupported panels (eg compared to a Marmot Alpinist)
Double poling with the clips going alternate directions can also add stability in winds.
The Black Label ones are more stable in higher winds and harsher conditions - heavier fabric, thicker poles and desgns that involve a) more poles b) more intersection points. Heavier though of course.
Mind you, he's a vid of a Tarra taking a beating in The Lakes district in the UK
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biAKJ0bEeEg
I like one comment "It doesn't get any stronger than Tarra really, well, except a double poled Tarra that is."

We just purchased a Jannu, hope to use it this winter. So two winter tents for us now - that and Scarp 2 (we have 4 of us in the family)
Decided against the Tarra as it's overkill for our needs and heavier (though I do lke the dual vesibules)

Not sure what we'll take to Patagonia in Dec - summer, but can get very windy.

[Giddy_up]

Hi Onestepmore, I just didn't realise how strong these tents really are. I am sure after seeing these vids you will be very safe in any Hilleberg tent in Patagonia.


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[mjdalessa]

The Marmot Thor 2p looks nicely designed.

[2ndstringqb]

I've got an Exped Venus II which has stood up to some decent winds (80+) very easily and can supposedly take a lot more. It's rated 4 season but this usually means 'winter' and using this kind in summer means a sweatbox. But this can be opened up on both sides to really let it ventilate in addition to the small top vents. For me it's been great in any condition or season.

[quicky]

I've got an Exped Venus II which has stood up to some decent winds (80+) very easily and can supposedly take a lot more. It's rated 4 season but this usually means 'winter' and using this kind in summer means a sweatbox. But this can be opened up on both sides to really let it ventilate in addition to the small top vents. For me it's been great in any condition or season.

I too have an Exped Venus II extreme. I've had mine exposed to +120kph winds....and it didn't budge. Rock solid tent....very breezy when opened for ventilation but can be battened down very quickly.

[Strider]

It's a shame they don't make a 1 person variant of the Venus.

[Dutchy]

great response, thanks guys!
As one said, i prefer freestanding tents over tunnels, and i often worry the tunnels get "flappy". I notived many hilleberg tunnels looking pretty average in alaska...
So i should add the bibler and exped to the list i see.... If i could get a fury for $300, I wouldnt think twice though!

[ninjapuppet]

kinda an impulse buy, but I just picked up a new MHW EV3 today for 50% off.
Only single skin but Ive been fairly content with my other single skin tent the Direkt 2 for the quick, fast and light alpine stuff, so thought i'd give this one a shot.
Mainly for the 2 men/3 nighter trips, so I guess I can afford to live with abit of dampness to trade for that extra bit of security with 4 poles and still only 3kg. Most other 4 pole geodesic tents weigh over 5kg

if you're interested in an EV3 at half price, PM me. Think they only got 2 left at that price.

[Wingnut]

Didn't the Exped Orion win a wind rating test awhile back?

"The most storm proof tent in the test comes from Switzerland. Three poles that cross each other and a wrinkle free and clean setup allowed the Orion to stand up against the howling 75 mph gust of the wind machine. Only at a windspeed of 81 mph did it give in. You can rely on this tent. It keeps you dry, vents well and offers easy handling. Setup takes less than 4 minutes and is easily done. Adjustable loops allow pegs to be set without trouble. The large amount of space in the vestibules is just great. The canopy is less generous but steep and high walls offer enough space for 2 campers."

[Dutchy]

what about the wilderness equipment Dart 2?

[sthughes]

Didn't the Exped Orion win a wind rating test awhile back?

"The most storm proof tent in the test comes from Switzerland. Three poles that cross each other and a wrinkle free and clean setup allowed the Orion to stand up against the howling 75 mph gust of the wind machine. Only at a windspeed of 81 mph did it give in. You can rely on this tent. It keeps you dry, vents well and offers easy handling. Setup takes less than 4 minutes and is easily done. Adjustable loops allow pegs to be set without trouble. The large amount of space in the vestibules is just great. The canopy is less generous but steep and high walls offer enough space for 2 campers."

Yeah, but in that test the rest of the tents were hardly proper 4 season tents. Most were variations on the Hubba/Goondie etc. formula of 2 poles, plus a short one (or 2). Only 2 others had 3 full poles, and one of those was a stupid design with them all running basically the same way.
The term "failure" is difficult. In the above test "failure" was considered when the tent was flattened by the wind, with no consideration for if it immediately popped back up undamaged after the "wind gust" abated, which is what tents like the Hilleberg tunnels are designed to do, and if they are deigned to do it it's hardly a "failure". Few of us will ever be caught out in an exposed location that just so happens to have a giant aircraft propeller blowing a constant 100kPh++ stream of air right at the most vulnerable side of the tent. So perhaps for the weight savings some of these tents enjoy, perhaps having the tent flatten briefly and pop back up undamaged after a wind gust (from the unexpected direction) isn't such a huge issue? But if it flattens the tent and the poles break, then it really is an issue!

[Rob A]

It doesnt cost you anything to take a spare bit of string.
One guy line the pole is still going ot flap around in the breeze, in an arc around the tent peg.
A second guy to the attachment is going ot triangulate and all of a sudden your tent poles are going nowhere.
Its not a case of what youve got, its how you use it.
Otherwise we would all be in Soulos.