Spot 2

[Lizzy]

Hey- Just wondering if anyone has recently got a Spot 2 or knows when they will be available? Also I guess these would be ok to be buying from o/s?? I think I read PLB's are better to be bought in Aus but seeing as these are registered in the US anyway....
Cheers
Lizzy

[photohiker]

My understanding is that they are not available.

They were released late last year, but there has been issues with the battery resulting in a recall and withdrawal from sale while they sort it out. I heard that things should be sorted soon, so I guess we might see them for sale in the next month or so.

[Ent]

Hi

The Spot is not a PLB but can act as one. You are correct that PLBs need to be registered in the country that they apply to so need to be programmed with the country code and this means brought locally. Spot is a rival system that uses a satellite phone system and you need to pay a yearly subscription fee while PLBs are forever, or until the battery goes flat and because replacing it is almost as much as the unit most people will dump the unit in three to seven years time while with Spot the batteries are replaceable.

Though they do the same job they are quite different beasts so best check all such units out so you can understand and accept or reject the up and down side of each approach.

Cheers Brett

[Lizzy]

Thanks guys,
Yeah- I am aware of the differences between a Spot & PLB.... but I do like the option of the spot 'check-in/ I'm ok' button to ease the minds of family at home. From what I've read it sounds like they work well when used correctly (ie upright, allow 20 mins etc). Ahhhh decisions, decisions....
Cheers Liz

[Ent]

Thanks guys,
Yeah- I am aware of the differences between a Spot & PLB.... but I do like the option of the spot 'check-in/ I'm ok' button to ease the minds of family at home. From what I've read it sounds like they work well when used correctly (ie upright, allow 20 mins etc). Ahhhh decisions, decisions....
Cheers Liz

Thanks to fellow site user we got to use a Spot 1 at Frenchmans Cap and yes the "ok" button is just great if you have nervous people at home that have been suitably terrified by the last round of media "over" reporting of some bushwalking event. I am like you, not sure what is the best way to go. Best of luck with whatever choice you make.

Cheers Brett

[MJD]

I bought a SPOT2 the day they got recalled!! Can't register it for use so it is sitting in my bottom desk drawer waiting for notification about what to do next regarding the promised exchange from overseas. Might ring the supplier up again to see if he knows anything new (he was/is happy to refund me but I was willing to wait).

[Lizzy]

Great timing MJD! I think I saw something about the 17th of Feb.... so maybe its time to check...

[MJD]

Looks like the Australian customers will be contacted by Pivotel within the next month or so to organise replacements.

[MJD]

Some action at last: a call from Pivotel checking my address so they can send packing material to return the SPOT2 for a replacement.

[MJD]

Got my replacement SPOT2 today. It's been activated and works in the back yard. Now I just need to get out on a walk .

[flatfoot]

I'm keenly watching the Delorme GPS that is soon to be released and supports SPOT (among other interesting features).

http://blog.delorme.com/2010/01/06/delorme-and-spot-handheld-gps-meets-satellite-communication/

[MJD]

Have used the SPOT 2 to send "OK" messages a couple of times from the tops of some mountains. Works well with either an sms to a mobile phone or an email to a specified address. Sends out your preset message and the coordinates of where you were.

Seems to get a satellite lock quite quickly. Have to try it in some light tree cover.

[photohiker]

I bought a Spot2 in April from the US for my Scotland trip, saved myself $100 over the Aussie price.

After testing it around home and setting up the email alerts, it lasted for 8 full days hiking with full tracking and twice-a-day OK messages before the original batteries started to run out (the red indicator light was blinking). This is most acceptable considering the unit uses those pathetic AAA batteries (albeit the lithium version)

Family and friends got great comfort waking up each morning and seeing my progress. This was my main purpose, and it worked extremely well.

The biggest issue was finding spare lithiums for it in Inverness - most shops either didn't sell them or were sold out, but I eventually found some.

[rowan]

I bought Spot one when they came out and looked at getting the next one but decided that the difference wasn't enough to be worth it. I LOVE MY SPOT.
The only trouble I have with mine is that it sometimes takes hours to get the satallites. Because I live full time in the bush, it is a real relief to my family for me to be able to send an I'm ok message every week, and I have changed the 'help' message to 'pick me up please'.
Batteries - I find that every supermarket or Kmark type store sells the lithium batteries - thankfully as I use them in all my gadgets.
If I was to get another one I would buy it from America as it is so much cheaper and I think they are made well enough that it is worth not having the warranty.

Cheers,
Rowan

[photohiker]

Nothing wrong with the Spot1, the Spot2 picks up some ergonomic and chipset improvements and a better antenna. Mine certainly picks up the Satellites pretty quick. Apparently, it is too easy to accidentally set off an SOS in the Spot1 and this has been addressed in the new model.

As far as the cost of the unit is concerned, don't forget that the services for the unit (basic service + tracking) cost US$165 per year, so almost as much as buying the hardware from the US, you can see where the business model sits!

[ninjapuppet]

G'day mate

I heard from another member her you had a spot 2
dont know much about them and was interested in how these work. I had a bit of a read around the net and I hear theres a subscription fee.

So do you have to sign up for a 3 year contract or something?
How much does each sms you send cost?
Can you send it to any mobile number? and do these spots also have a built in GPS so they can act as a epirb?

thanks.

[photohiker]

G'day mate

I heard from another member her you had a spot 2
dont know much about them and was interested in how these work. I had a bit of a read around the net and I hear theres a subscription fee.

So do you have to sign up for a 3 year contract or something?
How much does each sms you send cost?
Can you send it to any mobile number? and do these spots also have a built in GPS so they can act as a epirb?

thanks.

Hi.

Yes, there is a yearly subscription fee. If you want tracking, there is an additional yearly fee:

* Basic Subscription = $US115.00 per year
* Tracking = $US49.99 per year.

Contract is for one year, but you must cancel before the end of the year or it will renew each year.

Details are on a rather complicated website so here are links to pages to save you time: Spot Basic Services and Spot Additional Services (Tracking)

SMS notifications are part of the basic services. There is no extra charge for them. I have not tried to send them to a mobile, I use email addresses instead so I cannot vouch for the SMS to mobile functionality.

When tracking is on, the Spot sends a location message every 10 minutes which is displayed on a map at findmespot.com for your friends and family viewing pleasure. Depending on terrain etc, some messages may not get through, but the service is generally very good.

The Spot does have inbuilt GPS, so it will act kind of like an epirb. The main functional difference is that the Spot does not have a local radio broadcast like the epirb, so rescuers cannot tune into the radio to get a proximity check.

Hope that helps.

[ninjapuppet]

given those subscription fees, it would appear that the SPOT will work out quite abit more expensive than an epirb in the long run.

I think my GME MT410G was about $500, and it lasts 7 years with no subscription fees. (works out about $70/year)
after that I will need to pay $200 to replace the batteries to last another 7 years ( $30/year)
On the other hand, I am going to assume inflation is going to push the subscription fees up steadily over the next decade?
your prices indicate it currently stands at $805US (basic) - $1155 (tracking) US over the 7 years.

I know its hard to put a price on your safety but personally if I do a lot of trekking then I'd probably go the SPOT over the PLB.
espeically if i had family and friends who worry too much.
On the other hand in my circumstances if i'm lucky to squeeze in 2 major walks a year, then a PLB is probally what i'll stick with. I cant imagine my family or friends giving a rat's to log in and check where i am. haha

With the PLB, I had to register with amsa.gov.au for free, and they said its a good idea to log in to their website and put a little note of my trip plans before embarking on a major trip. they said rescues within australia are covered by the government, but rescues overseas are dependant on whatever their laws are.
if it is misused within australia, then I may have to foot the bill or part of it.

I wonder what happens if you're activating it in some 3rd world country out in the middle of nowhere where authorities dont really care???? sounds abit dodgy....
I'd probally trust my family members more with a SPOT in these circumstances.

[eggs]

We hired a spot from a Qld provider for a recent trip. They mail it out via Express Post.
In order to cover delivery times we took it for 13 days. $140 all up.

It worked well and it provided both SMS and email messages to location spotting via google.
The hire also included a personal web page to follow the route we took.
This had an data expiry so that as data was over about 2 weeks old it disappeared.

[prickle]

I have a Spot 1 .. works fine .. don't have the tracking function but can send an OK message at the end of the day or if we deviate from our proposed course .. keeps those that need to know in the know

[photohiker]

I wonder what happens if you're activating it in some 3rd world country out in the middle of nowhere where authorities dont really care???? sounds abit dodgy....
I'd probally trust my family members more with a SPOT in these circumstances.

I suspect that there would not be a lot of difference in the response under those circumstances. Best have good insurance

Spot offers an add-on GEOS member benefit of $US100k rescue services for $US20 a year.

[cams]

Can anyone comment on the Spot 2's performance compared to the 1? I've done some testing with a Spot 1 and it performed better than I expected but probably not good enough for me to get one. I'm hoping the Spot 2's improved antenna and GPS chip will improve its performance under foliage cover.

[flatfoot]

I'm thinking of buying a Spot 2 via a US-based seller on e-bay. I can save about $60 compared with buying from a local supplier. It will be about $170 posted to Australia.

My understanding is that I need the "Track Progress" service at USD $49.95 and GEOS search and rescue at USD $19.95. It seems that these are activated at findmespot.com. Am I missing something? Are these the appropriate services for Australia? I understood the subscription was around $150 or have they slashed their prices?

[prickle]

Hi FF

I have a Spot 1 and below is what I pay (i guess )

http://findmespot.com/en/index.php?cid=103

[flatfoot]

Thanks for pointing me in the right direction. I think I was confused by this service: http://au.findmespot.com/en/index.php?cid=104

It seems to be some fancy insurance add-on that includes private search and rescue. So do they dispatch these guys?

[tastrax]

No - these guys I think

http://www.geosalliance.com/sar/

[flatfoot]

I placed my order via ebay from a seller located in New York. I expect to receive it in the next 10 days.

There's a good video review here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbbDbw3zzyY&sns=em

[eddie the eagle]

Hi f_f,

For others looking to purchase, I'd suggest speaking to Keith McReynolds locally. Keith is a keen walker and former guide.

ADVENTURE SAFE
02 9482 9736
keith@adventuresafe.com.au

THey may cost a bit more, but you'll get service and a unit with local backup in the event of a warranty claim.

No commercial affiliation, have attended a course where Keith was an instructor.


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My in-depth look at the spot 2 vs spot 1, showed that the Spot unit works at a higher frequency (1610mHz) than an EPIRB (406MHz.)

Because it works at a higher frequency, it has less ability to penetrate cloud and tree cover than the lower frequency EPIRBs (one of the immutable laws of physics.)

I don't know if the emergency signal is transmitted at the lower frequency or at the SPOT tracker frequency.

THe link below is a commercial advertisement, but ignoring their bias, the facts are in there looking at the differences:
http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=147955270439

The SPOT tracker is owned/developed by the GlobalSTAR satellite company to improve their revenues. If it was using a competitor's satellite network, it'd be far more reliable.

I've decided not to upgrade to SPOT2

Cheers,

eddie

[photohiker]

A Spot (1 or 2) is not an EPIRB/PLB
An EPIRB/PLB is not a Spot.

The only crossover in functionality between these two devices is for the SOS/Emergency beacon.

As a Beacon, a GPS equipped EPIRB/PLB is arguably better because of the Satellite network it uses. If a new NASA project, MEOSAR gets up, an EPIRB/PLB will become outstandingly better due to the installation of SAR processing on board the GPS satellite constellation and the Galileo positioning system constellation. Link

As a remote area tracking, communication and emergency beacon, the Spot stands alone. Using it for tracking gives some idea of reliability of the device communications and in the several trips I have used mine for in varied terrain, it has dropped less than 5% of location transmissions. Some of those were because I dropped my pack face down and the spot was facing the ground with the pack above it. This error rate is regardless of cloud cover, time of day or phase of the moon.

Deep valleys with tree cover could be a problem with either system, depending on orientation in regards to the satellites. As with any Satellite communication, a clear view of the sky will give the best outcome.

So basically, don't buy a Spot if all you want is an EPIRB/PLB.

[eddie the eagle]

As a remote area tracking, communication and emergency beacon, the Spot stands alone. Using it for tracking gives some idea of reliability of the device communications and in the several trips I have used mine for in varied terrain, it has dropped less than 5% of location transmissions. Some of those were because I dropped my pack face down and the spot was facing the ground with the pack above it. This error rate is regardless of cloud cover, time of day or phase of the moon.

So basically, don't buy a Spot if all you want is an EPIRB/PLB.

Hi Michael,

I think you got the newer model that has given these results.


I agree with your comments, but the SPOT 1 has had a far less reliable success rate for me in light rainforest. 10% transmission rate, maybe.

Cloudy days also interfere with transmission on this one, but the moon phase didn't affect it. The way I held my tongue also didn't, but the cloud and forest cover did.

Because of this, I figured I wasn't going to throw any more good money after bad. I just use it when I'm at camp to transmit the "we're OK" message, and if a tracking signal gets through, it gets through.

Cheers,

eddie